| --- Log opened Wed Feb 01 00:00:36 2012 |
| 00:08 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 00:14 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
| 01:42 | | Derakon[AFK] is now known as Derakon |
| 02:24 | | Kindamoody[zZz] is now known as Kindamoody |
| 02:45 | | Attilla_ [Obsolete@Nightstar-0762f3cf.as43234.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 03:01 | <@ToxicFrog> | Woot woot |
| 03:01 | <@ToxicFrog> | Symbol and I just finished a game of Suicide Chess played using Felt |
| 03:02 | <@ToxicFrog> | One of us on Linux, one on Windows, multiple mid-game reconnects as I discovered a new crash bug in the client |
| 03:02 | <@ToxicFrog> | Went great |
| 03:02 | < maoranma> | (stupid alpha testers having all the fun) |
| 03:03 | <~Vornicus> | What was teh crash bug? |
| 03:03 | <~Vornicus> | "suicide chess"? |
| 03:05 | <@ToxicFrog> | Vornicus: pressing a key while the cursor was over an item which itself was resting on the background would try to call pos() on an event that doesn't support that. |
| 03:05 | <@ToxicFrog> | Really, the whole event handling structure in the client needs a redesign :/ |
| 03:06 | <@ToxicFrog> | Suicide Chess: kings aren't special, if you can take a piece you must do so, first person to lose all of their pieces wins |
| 03:06 | | Rhamphoryncus [rhamph@Nightstar-5697f7e2.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #code |
| 03:06 | <~Vornicus> | Weird. |
| 03:06 | <&Derakon> | Chess with force-capture is funky. |
| 03:06 | <@ToxicFrog> | The bug, or the game? |
| 03:07 | <~Vornicus> | The game. |
| 03:07 | <&McMartin> | Hrm |
| 03:07 | | * McMartin finishes drafting an ocamlyacc parser for Pascal based on a yacc parser for it. |
| 03:07 | <&McMartin> | It's a bit more verbose than the IR. |
| 03:07 | <&McMartin> | The IR and the lexer are about 100 lines each, and the parser is about 5x that. |
| 03:09 | <&McMartin> | I may have to mess with this a bit to make them interoperate, though. |
| 03:09 | <@ToxicFrog> | Vornicus: well, neither Symbol nor I really enjoy chess (I prefer Go, she's not a fan of strategy games in general), and SC goes much faster than normal chess as well. |
| 03:09 | <~Vornicus> | I've never found anyone to play go against, and so I, um. Don't know what I'm doing at all. |
| 03:23 | <@ToxicFrog> | There are plenty of public Go servers out there, which is how I play |
| 03:23 | <@ToxicFrog> | (I also don't know what I'm doing at all) |
| 03:25 | <&Derakon> | AIUI there are Go programs that can at the very least teach you the basics of play and get you to the "not completely incompetent" stage. |
| 03:27 | <~Vornicus> | I'm reminded of McM's description of Chessmaster 9000 |
| 03:27 | <~Vornicus> | To which I hope the sequel is in fact Chessmaster 9001 |
| 03:28 | <&Derakon> | Do tell. |
| 03:30 | <~Vornicus> | Where there is a tutorial, including descriptions of how each piece moves, and various strategies -- and this tutorial consists literally thousands of playable chess problems. |
| 03:30 | <@Eri> | Ha, I read force-capture and thought, like, a special ruleset for jedi pawns |
| 03:31 | <&Derakon> | Hee. |
| 03:31 | <&Derakon> | My favored way to play chess is Nightmare Chess. |
| 03:31 | <@Eri> | How's it work? |
| 03:31 | <&Derakon> | Where there's a set of cards and on your turn you can play one in addition to (or instead of, depending on the card) making a normal move. |
| 03:31 | <&Derakon> | So for example, a card that lets you ricochet your bishop off the border, or one that rotates the board 90?. |
| 03:32 | <@Eri> | Ooh |
| 03:32 | <&Derakon> | This of course completely destroys normal chess strategy, which relies on being able to predict the future. |
| 03:32 | <@Eri> | That'd be fun, but it kind of removes a lot of the forward strategy |
| 03:32 | <@Eri> | Yeah |
| 03:32 | | * Eri was too slow |
| 03:37 | <@ToxicFrog> | Vornicus: if I implemented Go in Felt, would you be interested in a game or two? |
| 03:37 | <~Vornicus> | Sure. |
| 03:38 | <@ToxicFrog> | Sweet. |
| 03:38 | <@ToxicFrog> | ...hmm. I'll need to implement a new type and a new method. |
| 03:52 | | * Vornicus befuddles for a bit at what his code is supposed to do. |
| 04:02 | < maoranma> | Make some... what do you call the objects? Elements? |
| 04:02 | <~Vornicus> | In this case, "knots" |
| 04:02 | < maoranma> | Anyway, make some black on one side and white on the other ones that can be flipped |
| 04:02 | <~Vornicus> | because I'm writing b-spline. |
| 04:02 | | * maoranma flips Vornicus |
| 04:02 | <&McMartin> | Woot. |
| 04:03 | | * McMartin has something resembling success |
| 04:03 | <~Vornicus> | I am not making othello, and neither is TF. |
| 04:03 | <~Vornicus> | Go is capture-by-removal. |
| 04:03 | <&McMartin> | It only resembles success because the error reporting is fucking terrible |
| 04:03 | < maoranma> | Is Othello = Reversi? |
| 04:03 | <&McMartin> | Othello is Reversi with a mirror-image start position and trademarked by Parker Brothers. |
| 04:03 | < maoranma> | Oh, never played it |
| 04:04 | < maoranma> | I am familiar with Go though, so I approve |
| 04:04 | < maoranma> | ToxicFrog: Is there some kind of save/load feature planned? |
| 04:05 | <@ToxicFrog> | maoranma: yes. |
| 04:05 | <@ToxicFrog> | (in fact it's already implemented, it's just not user-accessible yet) |
| 04:05 | < maoranma> | Awesome, now add Settlers of Catan pieces |
| 04:06 | | * McMartin now has a working Pascal parser, it looks like. |
| 04:06 | <@ToxicFrog> | Persistence was, in fact, one of the original mandatory features, because what kicked off this project was a desire to play Descent |
| 04:06 | <&Derakon> | Which can take awhile. |
| 04:06 | <@ToxicFrog> | In which a single game takes 4-6 hours and a Road to Legend campaign consists of 30+ such games |
| 04:06 | < maoranma> | Like, hours or days a while? |
| 04:06 | <@ToxicFrog> | And it does not serialize well |
| 04:06 | < maoranma> | Ahh |
| 04:07 | < maoranma> | Do you have plans to make this extensible to mini-wargames? |
| 04:07 | < maoranma> | Like Hoardes/Warjacks or Warhammer? |
| 04:07 | < maoranma> | Warmachine* |
| 04:08 | < maoranma> | Hordes*? fuck, why am I near a keyboard today |
| 04:08 | <~Vornicus> | I suspect properly 3d boards are a bit beyond it at the moment. |
| 04:08 | <~Vornicus> | Life is probably possible; Mousetrap is probably not possible. |
| 04:08 | <~Vornicus> | Well, okay, certainly not possible. |
| 04:10 | < maoranma> | True, a height map wouldn't be hard to simulate though |
| 04:10 | < maoranma> | Layering and some transparency on the fly, maybe a popup that shows the order of objects from the ground up or the sky down |
| 04:17 | <@ToxicFrog> | 3d is not going to happen. |
| 04:18 | <@ToxicFrog> | Simple heightmapping like Heroscape might happen at some point (Z-order is already implemented, it would just need a good way of expressing that to the user) |
| 04:18 | < maoranma> | Agreed |
| 04:28 | <&Derakon> | Heroscape technically allows units to go into caves and so on. |
| 04:28 | <&Derakon> | But it's such a pain to set up that kind of map in reality that it usually doesn't happen. |
| 04:34 | <&Derakon> | Heroscape has the notable problem of needing to be able to test line-of-sight though. |
| 04:34 | <&Derakon> | Which depends heavily on the shapes of the units in question. |
| 04:38 | | * Vornicus checks on heroscape for that. |
| 04:38 | <&Derakon> | Heroscape is basically minifig combat lite. |
| 04:39 | <~Vornicus> | Right, I see that. |
| 04:39 | <~Vornicus> | What does critter shape have to do with LOS? |
| 04:39 | <&Derakon> | Every unit has a colored silhouette on the unit card. |
| 04:40 | <&Derakon> | Red is vulnerable to attack, grey is invulnerable, and green is the unit's eyes. |
| 04:40 | <&Derakon> | If the eyes of unit A can see any red portion of unit B, then unit A can hit unit B with a ranged attack. |
| 04:40 | <~Vornicus> | That's actually considered? man. |
| 04:40 | <&Derakon> | Usually it doesn't really matter, but there's a dragon with huge fuck-off wings that are grey, for example. |
| 04:41 | <&Derakon> | And IIRC there's a mech with a Glowing Weak Point who must therefore be attacked pretty much only from directly in front or directly behind. |
| 04:41 | <&Derakon> | Or in melee, of course. |
| 04:41 | <~Vornicus> | How do you, um, measure that? |
| 04:41 | <&Derakon> | Eyeballs. |
| 04:41 | <~Vornicus> | ...gotcha. |
| 04:42 | <&Derakon> | Heroscape really is quite well thought-out, and I wish my group was more into that kind of game. But oh well. |
| 04:50 | <@Alek> | actually, a lot of miniatures players carry around tape measures just for that. |
| 04:50 | <@Alek> | and protractors, as well. amongst other things. |
| 04:52 | <@ToxicFrog> | Yes, but this isn't WH40K, it's heroscape. |
| 04:52 | <@ToxicFrog> | Line of sight is eyeballed, range is in hexes. |
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| 08:55 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
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| 10:02 | | * TheWatcher idly stabs the w3c for not allowing <img> inside <option> |
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| 11:43 | | Thalass|codery [Thalass@Nightstar-df50d3bd.bigpond.net.au] has joined #code |
| 11:44 | < Thalass|codery> | hey |
| 11:44 | <@jerith> | Hiya. |
| 11:56 | | * Thalass|codery is fiddling with python. |
| 12:11 | <@jerith> | In Soviet Russia, pyt... nah. |
| 12:12 | < Thalass|codery> | heh |
| 12:13 | <@jerith> | Python's attribute access philosophy is "consenting adults". |
| 12:24 | | * TheWatcher thanks Azathoth for cygwin |
| 12:24 | <@simon_> | hehe |
| 12:25 | <@TheWatcher> | This stuff would be so bloody irritating to do on windows without an actually functional set of shell tools... |
| 12:43 | | * Ling points at unix-utils, which takes much less time to install but doesn't cover as much |
| 12:44 | <@Ling> | It's zsh+coreutils |
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| 13:19 | | * TheWatcher points at the fact that he's had Cynwin installed for over 6 years, so doesn't have issues of install time ¬¬ |
| 13:26 | <@Ling> | That;'d do it |
| 13:33 | | * TheWatcher determines that the Skyrim soundtrack really doesn't work as coding background music, breaks out the Immediate Music instead |
| 13:37 | <@jerith> | TheWatcher: http://www.thinkwithportals.com/music.php |
| 13:43 | <@TheWatcher> | I actually pulled the music out of the data files >.> |
| 13:48 | | * TheWatcher grabs those anyway, in case there's better arrangements |
| 13:49 | <@jerith> | It's 3 discs worth. |
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| 15:50 | < gnolam> | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQIMGV5vtd4 <- "A Swarm of Nano Quadrotors" |
| 16:06 | <@ToxicFrog> | Ling: the issue with unxutils is, as you say, that you don't get as much; you don't get X, you don't get version control, you don't even get a terminal emulator |
| 16:06 | <@ToxicFrog> | Or a shell |
| 16:07 | <@ToxicFrog> | So if it's a system you're going to be using again in the future, it's definitely worth it to install Cygwin; even if you're in a hurry, MSYS is pretty tempting. |
| 16:07 | <@Ling> | You get zsh |
| 16:07 | <@Ling> | Which is a shell |
| 16:07 | <@Ling> | Yeah, I like MSYS |
| 16:08 | <@Ling> | Don't know if it comes with coreutils though |
| 16:12 | <@ToxicFrog> | Pretty sure it does; it's meant to provide a minimal environment that make and autoconf will run int |
| 16:12 | <@ToxicFrog> | (still doesn't get you X though) |
| 16:21 | < Rhamphoryncus> | gnolam: cool, but I was disappointed that they're not actually nano |
| 16:22 | < Rhamphoryncus> | I was expecting molecular motors |
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| 18:57 | <@ToxicFrog> | Aaw, kitten is trying to eat my laptop |
| 19:00 | <@jerith> | Is it a delicious laptop? |
| 19:05 | <@ToxicFrog> | She certainly seems to think so |
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| 20:26 | < Vornucopia> | Oh shit, I did it |
| 20:27 | <&McMartin> | You ate your laptop? |
| 20:27 | < maoranma> | again? |
| 20:27 | | * Vornucopia now has a working prototype of de Boor's algorithm. |
| 20:29 | <@jerith> | \o/ |
| 20:30 | < Vornucopia> | it's currently in Excel, but I don't think that's an issue. I'm seeing if there is a possible problem at high multiplicity existing knots |
| 20:31 | <&McMartin> | 08:21 < Rhamphoryncus> I was expecting molecular motors |
| 20:31 | <&McMartin> | Well, they're *made* of molecules |
| 20:32 | < Rhamphoryncus> | Quiet, pedant! |
| 20:33 | < maoranma> | http://elbenshira.com/curvey/ ? |
| 20:35 | < Vornucopia> | Oh, nice. |
| 20:35 | < Vornucopia> | Okay, all I have to do now is write this code. |
| 20:36 | < Vornucopia> | ...and save this spreadsheet because it does all the important work. |
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| 21:00 | < Vornucopia> | Hrm. Minor issue on clamped curves, at maximum t. Other than that I am having no issues. |
| 21:01 | < Vornucopia> | (I'm getting an indexing error or div/0 depending, so I may need to special case my a values for that situation. |
| 21:12 | < Vornucopia> | Woot, closed curves work. |
| 21:12 | < Vornucopia> | Okay, I think this I can send home and write actual code against. |
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| 23:58 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| --- Log closed Thu Feb 02 00:00:08 2012 |