| --- Log opened Thu Feb 19 00:00:30 2009 |
| 00:18 | | * gnolam adds font creation software to the list of areas in which open source fails. |
| 00:25 | <@McMartin> | God, yes. |
| 00:25 | <@McMartin> | This is one of those things where Only Classic MacOS software is proper. =P |
| 00:26 | | * McMartin needs to get his mind around Pixen.app, though. |
| 00:26 | <@Derakon> | I had a bookmark for a site where you could download a grid, fill it out with your own handwriting, send it in, and get a font file back... |
| 00:26 | <@Derakon> | Can't seem to find it now. :\ |
| 00:27 | | * TheWatcher will have it in logs, one moment |
| 00:29 | <@TheWatcher> | http://www.yourfonts.com/ |
| 00:30 | <@TheWatcher> | Derakon: there you go |
| 00:30 | <@Derakon> | Ah hah! Thanks. |
| 00:30 | <@Derakon> | I'd remembered "myfonts.com", which is a rather different site. |
| 00:30 | <@Derakon> | Anyway, just because it says it's for handwriting doesn't mean you can't put anything you want into the grid. |
| 00:31 | | * TheWatcher nodnod |
| 00:48 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 00:51 | | UndeadAnno [~farkoff@Nightstar-29579.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: I. AM. BEOWULF.] |
| 00:52 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
| 01:06 | | * Derakon flies about a starscape. |
| 01:10 | <@Derakon> | Hmm... |
| 01:10 | <@Derakon> | So, modules. I've written two dead-simple modules, one for engines and another for turnjets (turn rate being independent of engine thrust in this game). |
| 01:11 | <@Derakon> | Right now they're both in a list in Player: self.modules. When Player.update is called, every module in the player gets updated, and they may change the player's state. |
| 01:11 | < EvilDarkLord> | Derakon: Where's the current version of this again? |
| 01:11 | <@Derakon> | For example, calling StartingEngines.update(self, player) causes the engines to check if the player is thrusting, and if so, modify the player's current speed (and clamp it to the module's maximum speed, as needed). |
| 01:11 | | mode/#code [+o EvilDarkLord] by ChanServ |
| 01:12 | <@Derakon> | EDL: Fusillade is in beta 5. Selene, which I'm talking about ATM, is in pre-pre-pre-alpha. |
| 01:12 | <@EvilDarkLord> | I mean, is it up for grabs on a server somewhere? |
| 01:12 | <@Derakon> | You can grab Fusillade here: http://www.aegis-soft.com/games/fusillade |
| 01:12 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Ah, thanks. |
| 01:12 | <@Derakon> | :) |
| 01:12 | <@Derakon> | Enjoy! |
| 01:14 | <@Derakon> | Anyway, I'm wondering if maybe I should instead force modules to be more specific: e.g. the player has one engine module, one turnjet module, etc. And then the player handles updating its own state based on the parameters the modules carry. |
| 01:14 | <@Derakon> | This is more limiting but involves less code duplication between modules. |
| 01:14 | <@Derakon> | Alternatively I could fake some kind of inheritance. |
| 01:14 | <@Derakon> | ...oh, wait, Python has inheritance built-in. Okay, nevermind! |
| 01:16 | | mode/#code [+ooo Alek jerith Reiver] by Serah |
| 01:16 | <@Serah> | Hmmm... |
| 01:17 | | Serah [~Z@130.227.16.ns-12529] has quit [Quit: ] |
| 01:17 | <@Derakon> | Whee, it works! Hee hee hee. |
| 01:19 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Sweet, it works on Wine. |
| 01:19 | <@Derakon> | Awesome. |
| 01:19 | <@Derakon> | I've had conflicting reports about that. |
| 01:19 | <@EvilDarkLord> | My test case is a Fujitsu Amilo 1437G with a brand-new Ubuntu 8.10, FWIW. |
| 01:20 | <@Derakon> | Danke. |
| 01:21 | | Serah [~Z@130.227.16.ns-12529] has joined #code |
| 01:21 | | mode/#code [+o Serah] by ChanServ |
| 01:27 | <@gnolam> | PAYDIRT! |
| 01:28 | | * gnolam finds the Source SDK function that will let him trace lines through the world to the player. |
| 01:41 | <@Derakon> | Okay, I have the direction the player is pointed in, and the direction they are traveling in. |
| 01:42 | <@Derakon> | I have the first as "direction" and the second as "heading". Is that confusing? |
| 01:42 | <@Derakon> | Keep in mind other people will have to deal with this eventually. |
| 01:42 | <@Derakon> | (For modding) |
| 01:47 | | Vornicus [~vorn@Admin.Nightstar.Net] has joined #code |
| 01:47 | | mode/#code [+o Vornicus] by ChanServ |
| 01:48 | | Vornicus [~vorn@Admin.Nightstar.Net] has quit [Quit: ] |
| 01:49 | | Vornicus [~vorn@Admin.Nightstar.Net] has joined #code |
| 01:49 | | mode/#code [+o Vornicus] by ChanServ |
| 02:03 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Derakon: I'd use 'facing' for where they are pointed and 'direction' or 'heading' for where they're going. |
| 02:03 | <@Derakon> | That is better. Thanks. |
| 02:03 | <@McMartin> | facing and heading. |
| 02:03 | <@Derakon> | Yeah. |
| 02:03 | <@McMartin> | Or facing and "vector", especially if speed is involved. |
| 02:03 | <@McMartin> | ... This is going to be inertial? |
| 02:03 | <@Derakon> | I'm using polar. |
| 02:03 | <@McMartin> | The mind reels. |
| 02:03 | <@Derakon> | Yeah. |
| 02:03 | <@Derakon> | It's not proper space combat if it isn't inertial. |
| 02:04 | <@McMartin> | That hasn't stopped everyone else~ |
| 02:04 | | * Derakon facepalms. |
| 02:04 | <@McMartin> | For some reason I was thinking Thunder Force II and thought it was over terrain. |
| 02:04 | <@Derakon> | Combat'll be basically similar to Escape Velocity. |
| 02:04 | <@Derakon> | No, Selene is outer space, asteroids and floating bases and that kind of thing. |
| 02:04 | <@McMartin> | That said, you may find you want a max-speed velocity just to keep people from wrecking your collision detectors forever. |
| 02:04 | <@Derakon> | Already implemented. |
| 02:05 | <@McMartin> | OK, so, quasi-inertial, good~ |
| 02:05 | | GeekSoldier [~Rob@Nightstar-8573.midstate.ip.cablemo.net] has joined #code |
| 02:05 | | mode/#code [+o GeekSoldier] by ChanServ |
| 02:05 | <@Derakon> | Engines have three primary stats: thrust, maximum speed, and health. |
| 02:08 | <@Derakon> | Right, and that's the "reverse facing" button implemented. |
| 02:08 | <@Vornicus> | reverse facing like EV's? |
| 02:08 | <@Derakon> | Yeah. |
| 02:08 | <@Derakon> | Best idea ever for inertial spaceflight. |
| 02:20 | | * gnolam ponders gamma attenuation. |
| 02:22 | <@Derakon> | So I think the next thing to do is let the player shoot, then give the player something to shoot at, then do collision detection, then make the thing fight back. |
| 02:22 | <@McMartin> | Sounds like a plan. |
| 02:24 | <@Derakon> | And hell, I have bullets already. |
| 02:24 | <@Derakon> | Don't think the emitter would make a good enemy, though. |
| 02:26 | <@Vornicus> | heh |
| 02:30 | <@Derakon> | (Fast game developer hint #1: re-use assets!) |
| 02:31 | <@GeekSoldier> | I thought Fusillade was going to be pure evasion with no shooting. Did something new come up these last two days? |
| 02:31 | <@Derakon> | No. |
| 02:32 | <@Derakon> | Fusillade is pretty stable at this point, so I'm starting work on Selene. |
| 02:32 | <@GeekSoldier> | Oh, ok. |
| 02:32 | <@Derakon> | Since what remains to launch Fusillade is: 1) decide no new bug reports are coming in; 2) integrate with Paypal; 3) announce and advertise. |
| 02:32 | <@Derakon> | (With 0) fix any bug reports that do come in) |
| 02:39 | <@GeekSoldier> | Awesome. |
| 02:40 | <@GeekSoldier> | I wish I had the drive and/or time to put together a production-ready game the way you have. Bravo! |
| 02:40 | <@Derakon> | Heh. Thanks. |
| 02:40 | <@Derakon> | It helps that this is all I'm doing. |
| 02:40 | <@Derakon> | I quit my job last month. |
| 02:41 | <@GeekSoldier> | Heh, I'm not exactly in a job that grants much free time, nor does it allow to just quit. I suppose you have strong motivation to do so, then! |
| 02:43 | <@Derakon> | Anyone here know much about dynamically importing Python modules? |
| 02:43 | <@Derakon> | I'm going off of http://technogeek.org/2007/05/29/dynamic-module-loading-in-python-2/ |
| 02:43 | <@Derakon> | So I have a module that has a def getType(). I do "foo = __import__(modulename)" then "foo.getType()" and it complains at me. |
| 02:44 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Arg, those counterwossnameloops are getting scary. |
| 02:44 | <@Derakon> | Hee. |
| 02:45 | <@GeekSoldier> | Yeah, I fear that I have reached the vodka vs. programming comprehension wall. |
| 02:45 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Derakon: I don't know if this qualifies as a bug, but arrow navigation of menus would be really neat. |
| 02:46 | <@Derakon> | It'd also be pretty fiddly to add with my UI implementation. |
| 02:46 | <@Derakon> | About the best I can offer is that I'll try to do better next time around. :\ |
| 02:48 | <@Reiver> | Derakon: You quit your job? |
| 02:48 | <@Reiver> | To write games, or other circumstances? |
| 02:48 | <@Derakon> | It wasn't a good fit. |
| 02:49 | <@Derakon> | I would have kept the job if it were; I value a steady income. |
| 02:49 | <@Reiver> | Bad enough to quit during a recession?~ |
| 02:49 | <@Derakon> | But, given that it wasn't a good fit, I decided to take a few months and try the whole indie game developer thing, see if that works. |
| 02:49 | <@Derakon> | Rather than try to find a job during a recession, yes. |
| 02:49 | <@Reiver> | Hm. You've the funds for it? |
| 02:54 | <@Derakon> | I can hold out for quite a while if I have to. I was saving up to buy a house. |
| 02:56 | <@Reiver> | ... ah. |
| 02:56 | <@Reiver> | Hrm. |
| 02:56 | <@Reiver> | You've given up on that hope, then? |
| 02:56 | <@Derakon> | Delayed. |
| 02:56 | <@Derakon> | I've set a deadline of six months. |
| 02:56 | <@Derakon> | (Of which one has now passed) |
| 02:57 | <@Derakon> | At that time, I'll evaluate where things stand with respect to my games and my job prospects and decide what to do. |
| 02:57 | <@Derakon> | In an ideal world, Fusillade and Selene will be bringing in enough money that I can keep doing game development. In a hideous world, neither are doing well and the economy is still tanked. |
| 02:57 | <@Derakon> | The likely prospect is that in six months I'll start working on getting a real job again. |
| 03:00 | <@Derakon> | Augh. I just spent a good 20 minutes tracking down a bug that was due to Python leaving behind its precompiled bytecode. |
| 03:01 | <@Vornicus> | Yeah, you usually need to go rm foo.py* |
| 03:01 | <@Derakon> | Anyway, dynamic loading of ship modules is implemented. |
| 03:02 | | * Vornicus has determined that he's not yet a very confident programmer. |
| 03:02 | <@Derakon> | Howso? |
| 03:03 | | gnolam [lenin@Nightstar-1382.A163.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Z?] |
| 03:03 | | * Vornicus can't seem to finish anywhere near as much code as anybody else; this despite his skill being Pretty Damn Good. |
| 03:04 | <@Reiver> | Vorn: You tend to lose focus halfway through. |
| 03:04 | <@Derakon> | This is not nearly so uncommon as you think. |
| 03:04 | <@Derakon> | I generally find that any project I start, at about the 25%, 50%, and 90% marks I go through an "anything but this!" stage which makes it very hard to focus on finishing the job. |
| 03:05 | <@Vornicus> | I lose focus because I keep getting slightly stuck and that kills me. |
| 03:05 | <@Vornicus> | I need a Manager. |
| 03:05 | <@Vornicus> | I also need a fullscreen editor, so I can shut out the distractions. |
| 03:06 | <@Vornicus> | Oh, and ritalin would help. |
| 03:11 | <@Derakon> | Argh, I thought the "about face" code went too smoothly. >.< |
| 03:14 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Derakon: On Wine, the game seems to slow down to ~5 fps occasionally and then stay that way until a restart, though I'm having trouble reproducing this with specific steps. |
| 03:15 | <@Derakon> | That's no good. |
| 03:15 | <@Vornicus> | I get the impression that Der should create a linux version. It shouldn't be too hard. |
| 03:15 | <@EvilDarkLord> | This *could* be my test machine being silly, but I'm not sure. |
| 03:15 | <@Derakon> | The trouble is where I put all my dependencies, Vorn. |
| 03:15 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Also, one thing you want out before production: the course named Test. |
| 03:16 | <@Derakon> | Yeah, it's gone. :) |
| 03:17 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Boxfire looks delicious and horrible. :) |
| 03:17 | <@Derakon> | Hee. |
| 03:18 | <@Reiver> | Derakon: Could not Vorn and TF and the like help advise you on the dependancies bit? |
| 03:18 | <@Reiver> | Also, tangenital query: Can you sell things on Linux without releasing the source code? I forget how that works. |
| 03:18 | <@Vornicus> | Reiver: you certainly can. |
| 03:18 | <@Vornicus> | Doom 3 was released on Linux. |
| 03:18 | <@Vornicus> | I don't think that source is out yet. |
| 03:19 | <@Reiver> | How's that work with the GPL, then? |
| 03:19 | <@Derakon> | There's a not insignificant number of games that get released on Linux primarily because the game creators' servers for multiplayer run Linux. |
| 03:19 | <@Vornicus> | Nobody says software for Linux has to be under the GPL. |
| 03:19 | <@Derakon> | The GPL says "If you use this software, any changes you make must be released under the GPL, and you must provide a copy of the source code to anyone who asks for a nominal fee."< |
| 03:19 | <@Derakon> | s/<// |
| 03:20 | <@Derakon> | But my game does not constitute a change to Linux. |
| 03:20 | <@Derakon> | It's its own thing. |
| 03:20 | <@Reiver> | Aaah. And you don't plan to use any pre-existing code to integrate it. |
| 03:20 | <@Derakon> | Nothing that requires me to release source code, anyway. |
| 03:20 | <@Derakon> | Anything you make with Python's your own; otherwise nobody'd use it. |
| 03:20 | <@Derakon> | Anything you run through py2app is similarly your own. |
| 03:23 | <@Derakon> | Okay, I think that the reversing works again. >.< |
| 03:23 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Derakon: I got a crash in the menu about maximum number of bullets exceeded. |
| 03:23 | <@EvilDarkLord> | This seems like it might be platform-independent. |
| 03:23 | <@Derakon> | Yeah, it is. |
| 03:23 | <@Derakon> | Which course were you watching? |
| 03:24 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Damn, I didn't check. Sorry. I'll try to reproduce. |
| 03:24 | <@Derakon> | I assume you were basically letting the demo just run? |
| 03:24 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Yep. |
| 03:25 | <@Derakon> | Yeah, it's an easy problem to run into -- if the pattern makes more bullets as difficulty increases, it'll eventually make more than it's allowed to. |
| 03:25 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Probably the Extra course, but I'm checking again to make sure. |
| 03:25 | | * Derakon nods. |
| 03:25 | <@Derakon> | I'm running Mania right now myself. We'll see which fails first. |
| 03:25 | <@Derakon> | Turn on Turbo to speed things up. |
| 03:26 | <@Derakon> | (You'd think I'd've remembered to check this, since this is far from the first time this has happened) |
| 03:26 | | * Reiver would suggest having a limiter such that once the emitter hits a certain point, it stops producing bullets. |
| 03:26 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Does Turbo turn off the frame rate limiter or double the speed or what? |
| 03:26 | <@Reiver> | Rather than throwing an error, it puts the brakes on. |
| 03:26 | <@Derakon> | Double the speed. |
| 03:26 | <@Derakon> | Reiver: not a bad idea, that... |
| 03:27 | <@Derakon> | The pattern could break in weird ways, but that's preferable to a crash. |
| 03:27 | <@Reiver> | Or better yet, given this would break patterns, that could in fact throw a 'game end' effect. And record your high score. |
| 03:27 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Derakon: Better yet, don't generate levels that will give too many bullets ;) |
| 03:27 | <@Derakon> | That's the solution I've been going with, EDL. |
| 03:27 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Yep, there we go again. |
| 03:27 | <@Derakon> | Okay, Extra. Which pattern? |
| 03:28 | <@Reiver> | EDL: Kind of a problem given that's how it makes games harder. |
| 03:28 | <@Reiver> | Could make for some funky really high level play, where half the goal is to keep the screen clear with Inflector Madness to stretch the gameplay... |
| 03:28 | <@Reiver> | (Of course, the person doing this is a National Champion of Korea who had a USB interface installed in his arm, but...~) |
| 03:28 | | * Derakon facepealms. |
| 03:29 | <@Reiver> | But it strikes me as the emergent solution to the straightforward bugfix~ |
| 03:29 | | * Derakon blinks. "EDL, where's the emitter during Boxfire for you?" |
| 03:29 | <@Derakon> | "And does Tracker make a circle of red bullets, or a straight line?" |
| 03:30 | <@EvilDarkLord> | THe emitter seems to be at the bottom center. |
| 03:30 | <@Derakon> | Damn. |
| 03:30 | <@Derakon> | What the hell happened there? It's totally broken. |
| 03:30 | <@EvilDarkLord> | The tracker used to make a line, now it makes a circle. Wtf. |
| 03:30 | <@Derakon> | ...oh, wait, turbo! |
| 03:30 | <@Reiver> | Turbo changes the game rules? |
| 03:30 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Ah yes. It's on. |
| 03:30 | <@Derakon> | It shouldn't. |
| 03:31 | <@Derakon> | But changeLocation forgot to take turbo into account. |
| 03:31 | <@Derakon> | So it's calculated frames based on the non-turbo rates of change. Which oddly enough make a circle for Tracker. Heh. |
| 03:31 | | * Reiver still means to learn the system and write up the Death Orb. |
| 03:32 | <@Derakon> | Well, there's documentation now. |
| 03:32 | <@Reiver> | It would home faster than you can move, leaving a trail behind it. Trick would be to use jinking and maybe the Inflector to force it to overshoot and arc round, and then not get tangled up. >_> |
| 03:36 | <@EvilDarkLord> | ...oh, there's an inflector. |
| 03:36 | | * EvilDarkLord should really RTFM on these things~ |
| 03:36 | <@Derakon> | Heh. |
| 03:36 | <@Derakon> | The help did display the first time you played, didn't it? |
| 03:36 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Yes, I was just too eager to get to play to read it properly. :p |
| 03:36 | | * Derakon smacks his forehead. |
| 03:36 | <@Derakon> | Not much I can do here, folks! |
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| 03:38 | <@Reiver> | To your credit, with the exception of the ship movement and inflector, the rest of the game is self-apparent enough that you could play quite a while and never realise it existed. |
| 03:39 | <@Derakon> | The vulnerable region of the ship seems to catch up quite a few people as well. |
| 03:39 | <@Reiver> | Aye. The instant assumption is that it's the blue spot. |
| 03:39 | <@Reiver> | Kind of a pity you can't rig things so that's the case~ |
| 03:39 | <@Derakon> | Cheek. :p |
| 03:40 | <@EvilDarkLord> | I figured out the vulnerable spot right away, and I poked the common buttons to see if they did anything, but that was it. |
| 03:40 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Common buttons being space, enter, ctrl in my book. :) |
| 03:40 | <@Reiver> | Minor UI query: Why are you using /right/ shift? |
| 03:41 | <@Reiver> | As the default, I mean? |
| 03:41 | <@Derakon> | No good reason. |
| 03:41 | <@Reiver> | When I heard shift fired the inflector, the automatic assumption was left-shift. |
| 03:41 | <@Reiver> | Given my right hand is on the arrow keys, the left hand tends to hover near WASD. |
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| 03:43 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Oo, reverse inflector. Shiny. |
| 03:43 | <@Derakon> | Heh. |
| 03:43 | <@Derakon> | The reverse inflector is "I want to see how nasty things get" mode. |
| 03:43 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Now if you could switch between that and the normal one... |
| 03:44 | <@Derakon> | Then the game would be impossible to balance. |
| 03:44 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Probably. |
| 03:44 | <@Reiver> | Derakon: With the drawback that you can't charge it at all. :) |
| 03:44 | <@Derakon> | It'd be "cheese the patterns I'm good at to get a massive multiplier, then switch to the reverse inflector on the ones I suck at to preserve bombs." |
| 03:44 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Protip: Don't try to defend against the chargelaser with the reverse inflector. |
| 03:44 | | * Derakon snickers. |
| 03:44 | <@EvilDarkLord> | BULLET SWARM NOM NOM NOM. :) |
| 03:44 | <@Derakon> | No, that won't work. |
| 03:45 | <@Derakon> | Bullets moving too fast cannot be inflected or deflected. |
| 03:45 | | * Reiver notes idly that the reverse inflector slaughters your score, too. Found that an interesting quirk. |
| 03:45 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Ooh, I have a highscore. |
| 03:45 | <@Reiver> | Derakon: Oh yes they can. |
| 03:45 | <@Derakon> | It's a reverse inflector, with all that means. |
| 03:46 | <@Derakon> | It drains your multiplier and your bomb count, and pushes bullets away. |
| 03:46 | <@Reiver> | Well, not /effectively/, but it still creates bomb charges. |
| 03:46 | <@Derakon> | Reiver: experiment with Windmill and you'll see what I mean. |
| 03:46 | <@Reiver> | hm |
| 03:48 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Is it just me, or is the sanest way of defending against late-stage crossfire to just camp near the emitter and hope your reflexes are up to it? |
| 03:48 | <@Derakon> | Heh. |
| 03:48 | <@Derakon> | Late-stage Crossfire gets ridiculous. They all do. |
| 03:48 | <@Reiver> | ... they inflected. |
| 03:49 | <@Reiver> | Not /much/, but I still charged half a bomb off it. |
| 03:49 | <@Derakon> | Reiver: even at their top speed? |
| 03:49 | <@Derakon> | Move in close to the emitter and hold down the inflector. |
| 03:49 | <@Reiver> | Ah. I was close, but not super close. |
| 03:49 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Yet Another Feature Request: Getting to practice individual patterns. |
| 03:50 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Or would that be cheating? |
| 03:50 | <@Derakon> | Not cheating, really. Just not something I've worked into the UI as its own feature. |
| 03:50 | <@Reiver> | Hm. |
| 03:50 | <@Derakon> | If you register, you can make your own courses with only one pattern in them, but there's no real facility for dealing with patterns in-game. |
| 03:51 | <@Derakon> | I recognize this is suboptimal. |
| 03:51 | <@Derakon> | Anyway, turbo bug is fixed. |
| 03:52 | <@Derakon> | As is the bullet overflow bug in Wave. |
| 03:52 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Can you make hyperlinks work inside the game? The registration screen could use one. |
| 03:53 | <@Derakon> | Not with any significant ease. |
| 03:53 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Mumble. And here I was about to register and give you five hard-earned dollars, but the game does not tell me how to do it! :) |
| 03:54 | <@Derakon> | Oh, right! |
| 03:54 | <@Derakon> | I thought you meant clickable hyperlinks. |
| 03:54 | <@Derakon> | I've been meaning to add the website address to the game for ages. |
| 03:54 | <@Derakon> | It's http://www.aegis- |
| 03:54 | <@Derakon> | www.aegis-soft.com/games/fusillade |
| 03:54 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Well, yeah. But the other kind is okay if you can't make those. |
| 03:54 | <@Derakon> | Thanks for the reminder. >.< |
| 03:55 | <@Reiver> | Also, it'd be $2.50 at the moment~ |
| 03:56 | <@Derakon> | Right. Game's in beta, you get it half-cost. |
| 03:56 | <@EvilDarkLord> | And the other link on that page to buying it is broken. |
| 03:56 | <@EvilDarkLord> | "Snag your registration code today" |
| 03:56 | <@Derakon> | Wow, I'm a paragon of ineptitude today. |
| 03:56 | <@Reiver> | What the shit |
| 03:56 | <@Derakon> | It's .html instead of .php, Reiver. |
| 03:56 | <@Reiver> | No, no |
| 03:57 | <@Reiver> | Boxfire just crashed, and I do not visibly see a million bullets on screen. |
| 03:57 | <@Derakon> | Okay, fixed. |
| 03:57 | <@Derakon> | Reiver: it's the start of Wave. |
| 03:57 | <@Reiver> | ... Ohhhh. |
| 03:57 | <@Derakon> | And remember, it's the bullets created, not the bullets present. |
| 03:57 | <@Reiver> | Yeah, that'd do it. |
| 03:57 | <@EvilDarkLord> | And because I'm hard in nitpick mode, the box to GO BUY THIS THING NOW IT IS AWESOME is not visible at first on page-load, you have to scroll down. |
| 03:58 | <@Reiver> | You got a fix for that yet? |
| 03:58 | <@Derakon> | Yep. |
| 03:58 | <@Derakon> | It'll be in beta 6. |
| 03:58 | <@Reiver> | Righto. |
| 03:58 | <@Reiver> | Just thought I'd mention. |
| 03:58 | <@Derakon> | EDL: mmm, yeah, that's bad page design. :\ |
| 03:58 | | * Reiver is a fairly decent beta tester, or at least tries to be! |
| 03:58 | <@Derakon> | Guess I should shrink down the graphics. |
| 03:58 | <@Derakon> | :) |
| 03:59 | <@Reiver> | Derakon: Better yet, get an actual link not in-text. |
| 03:59 | <@Derakon> | You mean the "Preorders open!" link? |
| 03:59 | <@Derakon> | It's still below the fold. |
| 03:59 | <@Reiver> | Buy Now: Preorders Open! |
| 03:59 | <@Derakon> | I mean, it's visible on my 24" display, but I can't expect the average user to see it right off. They'd see the header bar and the massive Fusillade graphic. |
| 03:59 | <@Reiver> | Or something. |
| 04:00 | <@Reiver> | Have the word 'Buy' in there somewhere. Or 'Purchase'. Or 'Extortion Fund'. |
| 04:00 | <@Reiver> | :p |
| 04:00 | <@Reiver> | Hm. |
| 04:00 | <@Reiver> | Minor thought: You have a "Download" section. |
| 04:00 | <@Reiver> | Have a "Purchasing" section in the same box? |
| 04:01 | <@Reiver> | Or Purchase, or somethin'. |
| 04:01 | <@Reiver> | I should be able to not have to engage my brain in order to have a nice obvious page element leap at me with the button I must click. ;) |
| 04:01 | <@Derakon> | Okay, compare: http://derakon.dyndns.org/games/fusillade/ |
| 04:01 | <@Derakon> | Vs. http://www.aegis-soft.com/games/fusillade/ |
| 04:02 | <@Reiver> | Neither. I was actually thinking of having another title like "Download". |
| 04:02 | <@Reiver> | With a link under it saying Preorders Open!. |
| 04:03 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Still looks odd. I'd put the download box to the right of the first piece of text with standard HTML table use. |
| 04:03 | <@Derakon> | I'm trying to avoid tables for non-tabular data. |
| 04:03 | <@Derakon> | And Reiver: problem there is that there's nothing in the Purchase box... |
| 04:03 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Don't. |
| 04:04 | <@Derakon> | I've done well so far. |
| 04:04 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Or get good at using CSS. |
| 04:04 | <@Reiver> | (CSS is ideal.) |
| 04:04 | <@Derakon> | The site's plain but functional. |
| 04:05 | <@Reiver> | Derakon: I mean that you'd have a box with "Download" [Beta][Windows][Mac] "Purchase" [Preorders Open!] |
| 04:05 | <@Reiver> | With later having Preorders Open replaced with [Google Checkout][Paypal][Firstborn Son] |
| 04:05 | | * Derakon snerks. |
| 04:06 | | * Reiver assumes his formatting is translatable without explanation. |
| 04:06 | <@Derakon> | I'll need to do a minor redesign when the game launches, and at that point I think that's definitely worth considering. |
| 04:06 | <@Derakon> | At this point, though, I'm deathly sick of webdev. :( |
| 04:06 | <@Reiver> | No problem. |
| 04:06 | <@Derakon> | Thanks for the feedback, though, it is appreciated. |
| 04:06 | <@Reiver> | But I just thought I'd mention; it seemed a logical first-glance layout. |
| 04:07 | <@Derakon> | And if I'm still being a numbskull when Fusillade goes gold, thwack me over the head. |
| 04:07 | <@Reiver> | (I'm sure an actual webdev guru would scorn me for such a simplistic thing, but...) |
| 04:08 | <@Derakon> | The site as a whole is simplistic. |
| 04:08 | | * Vornicus points out that SIMPLE IS GOOD, DAMN YOUR EYES |
| 04:08 | <@Derakon> | I threw it together over the course of a week. |
| 04:08 | <@Reiver> | Aye, I was trying to keep it that way. |
| 04:08 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Simple is good, when you have only a few options, as you do. |
| 04:08 | <@Vornicus> | Frontload the goodies, make it easy for people to give you money. |
| 04:08 | <@Reiver> | (And indeed, half the logic behind the suggestion is that it's literally copy-paste code.) |
| 04:09 | <@Reiver> | (No new page elements, just an extra titlebar to help emphasise the SEND ME MONIES section in the same box as the Downloads.) |
| 04:09 | | * Derakon uploads some minor tweaks to production, anyway. |
| 04:10 | <@Derakon> | The logo's smaller so the "Purchase" link is above the fold. |
| 04:10 | <@Derakon> | Or should be, anyway. |
| 04:10 | <@Reiver> | And idle curiosity: The bullets go from hollow to solid. Any actual pattern behind that or is it just a timer? |
| 04:10 | <@Reiver> | Derakon: ... Aye, that'll do for the interim. |
| 04:10 | <@Derakon> | When created, they start on frame 1 of the animation. Every 24 frames they cycle back to where they started. |
| 04:11 | <@Reiver> | Looks a little odd having the Purchase titlebar the actual hyperlink, but for the moment it'll do |
| 04:11 | <@Reiver> | If you're worried about having a title with a single line under it looking odd, you could possibly do something like, uh |
| 04:12 | <@Reiver> | "Purchase" [Preorders open!][Preorders pay half price! Don't delay! Limited time only! Buy now and also recieve a free potato peeler!] |
| 04:12 | <@Derakon> | Heh. |
| 04:13 | <@Reiver> | Wording modified, of course. ¬¬ |
| 04:13 | <@Derakon> | Oooh, I got three hits off of Google today! |
| 04:13 | <@Reiver> | But you do have a plaintext [Requirements] bulletpoint in the above, so hitting home that it's discounted in the Purchase section would not be a bad idea either. |
| 04:14 | <@Reiver> | Before you hit the link, I mean. :) |
| 04:18 | | * Derakon mutters at HTML for not inserting line breaks where they belong. |
| 04:21 | <@Derakon> | Okay, how's this look? http://derakon.dyndns.org/games/fusillade/index.php |
| 04:22 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Much better. |
| 04:22 | <@EvilDarkLord> | You can actually see the 'download' screen right away, at least on my resolution. |
| 04:22 | <@Derakon> | What is your resolution, anyway? |
| 04:23 | <@EvilDarkLord> | 1280 x 800. |
| 04:23 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Effectively 1240 x 600 of browser space or so. |
| 04:24 | | * Derakon nods. |
| 04:26 | | Serah [~Z@130.227.16.ns-12529] has quit [Quit: ] |
| 04:26 | <@Derakon> | Right, that's about enough webdev for one evening. ¬.¬ |
| 04:26 | <@Reiver> | Much improved. |
| 04:31 | <@Derakon> | Now what in blazes was I doing before EDL reported that bug? |
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| 06:41 | <@Reiver> | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_Grid - Wow. Looks like the ubiquitous range of tower defense games grew up with Shiny Graphics. |
| 06:42 | <@Derakon> | I've never liked tower defense games. |
| 06:49 | <@Derakon> | Y'know, this whole moddability thing becomes so much easier when your entire damn program is written in the interpreted language. ¬.¬ |
| 06:49 | <@Derakon> | No passing back and forth between Lua and C++! |
| 06:50 | <@Vornicus> | Quite. |
| 06:51 | <@Derakon> | I mean, making this game moddable basically amounts to an hour figuring out how to dynamically load modules and making my code slightly cleaner than it otherwise would be. |
| 07:12 | | Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@Nightstar-7184.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 07:21 | | Derakon is now known as Derakon[AFK] |
| 07:23 | <@Reiver> | So where does the content start and the core game stop? The registration key?~ |
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| 08:43 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
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| 11:30 | <@gnotexture> | What the /fuck/, Vista? |
| 11:30 | <@gnotexture> | Rearranging my start menu is _not cool_. |
| 11:35 | <@TheWatcher> | lovely :/ |
| 11:36 | <@TheWatcher> | Good old Win XP ME. |
| 13:01 | | * Reiver is actually looking forward to Windows 7. |
| 13:05 | <@TheWatcher> | On th ebasis of "they couldn't screw it up even more"? ¬¬ |
| 14:28 | <@gnotexture> | Gargh. |
| 14:28 | <@gnotexture> | Et tu, Inkscape? |
| 14:28 | | gnotexture is now known as gnolam |
| 14:28 | <@UndeadAnno> | Well, at least you aren't getting messages from God on your desktop. |
| 14:29 | <@TheWatcher> | Hey, gnolam, what's your IP? ¬¬ |
| 14:30 | <@gnolam> | Whut? |
| 14:30 | <@UndeadAnno> | http://www.insecuritymovie.com/ |
| 14:30 | <@UndeadAnno> | It's a good movie. |
| 14:30 | <@TheWatcher> | Oh, just wondering what youre IP address is, for no particular reason |
| 14:31 | <@TheWatcher> | -e |
| 14:36 | <@Serah> | Why do you wonder what his IP is? |
| 14:42 | <@TheWatcher> | What do you think? |
| 15:03 | <@gnolam> | Rule of thumb of the day: "1 Bq is a rather small amount of radioactivity. Indeed it is easy to remember its definition if you think of it as a /buggerall/ amount of radioactivity. For this reason the kilobecquerel (kBq) and megabecquerel (MBq) are more frequently used." |
| 15:05 | < Tarinaky> | UndeadAnno: Just kidding, it's the other guy. |
| 15:05 | | * TheWatcher ponders ways to apply kilobuggeralls and megabuggeralls at the next meeting in work... |
| 15:06 | < Tarinaky> | Kill them all slowly with a radioactive source? |
| 15:06 | <@TheWatcher> | Tempting, but ultimately messy and likely to lead to a plague of mutant. |
| 15:06 | <@TheWatcher> | +s |
| 15:07 | < Tarinaky> | Could just be the office wanker and quote that verbatim for no reason in a smug way. |
| 15:09 | | KBot [AnnoDomini@Nightstar-29197.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #Code |
| 15:10 | <@gnolam> | Also, "bugger rolls" sounds like it could be a dish. Not one I'd ever order, but still. |
| 15:10 | | KarmaBot [AnnoDomini@Nightstar-29579.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 15:10 | <@gnolam> | "I'd like one kebab with fries and a bugger roll, please." |
| 15:11 | | * gnolam has slept too little (again) and is in free association mode. |
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| 16:20 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[afk] |
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| 19:17 | | * Derakon downloads VirtualBox. |
| 19:17 | <@Derakon> | Let's get started on this Linux thing. |
| 19:19 | <@Derakon> | Hm. First problem: finding a guide to installing Ubuntu on VirtualBox instead of the other way around. |
| 19:20 | | Reiver [~reaverta@Admin.Nightstar.Net] has quit [Ping Timeout] |
| 19:24 | <@Derakon> | Next: wait for 700MB of disk image to download~ |
| 19:30 | | * simontwo praises netinstall |
| 19:31 | <@Derakon> | VirtualBox wants a disk image or an actual physical disk. |
| 19:35 | | * Derakon ponders gun/bullet setups. |
| 19:35 | <@Derakon> | What I'm thinking right now is this: |
| 19:35 | <@Derakon> | Guns have firing rates, inaccuracy, cooldown times, etc. |
| 19:36 | <@Derakon> | Bullets have damage, lifespan, and graphics. |
| 19:36 | <@Derakon> | When you run update() on a Gun object, it checks if the player is firing and its cooldown time has expired, and if so, it generates a new Bullet object. |
| 19:36 | <@Derakon> | Bullet objects also have location, etc. |
| 19:37 | <@Derakon> | The update() functions return all active objects created during them. So calling player.update() returns the player and any bullets made by the player (and any extra effects, e.g. shields, turrets, that the player may have made). |
| 19:37 | <@Derakon> | Calling enemyBase.update() returns all ships the enemy base made that frame. |
| 19:37 | <@Derakon> | And the enemy base. |
| 19:38 | <@Derakon> | The engine appends all these guys to a list, and on the next frame, it calls update() on them directly. They return themselves to indicate that they're still alive, or nothing if they have expired for whatever reason. |
| 19:38 | | Reiver [~reaverta@Nightstar-23804.xdsl.xnet.co.nz] has joined #Code |
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| 19:38 | <@Derakon> | Does all this sound reasonable? |
| 19:42 | | Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@Nightstar-7184.ed.shawcable.net] has joined #code |
| 19:44 | <@Derakon> | My big issue at the moment actually is one of language. Within the Gun object I want to say "self.munition = SomeClassName" without instantiating a SomeClassName object right then. I want instantiation of the SomeClassName to be done at firing time. |
| 19:46 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Is this a problem for some reason? This seems quite doable with Python. |
| 19:46 | <@Derakon> | Well, I admit I haven't tried running my code right now, but I suspect the syntax is invalid. |
| 19:47 | <@Derakon> | My goal is for various modules to subclass the Gun module, specify their own munition classes, and let the Gun update() function do their work for them. |
| 19:47 | <@Derakon> | So in Gun.update() there should be a "self.munition(location, direction, speed)". |
| 19:48 | <@EvilDarkLord> | Okay. IIRC this is quite proper. |
| 21:15 | <@McMartin> | Looks good to me. |
| 21:15 | <@McMartin> | Just remember you have to pass self explicitly as an argument. |
| 21:16 | <@McMartin> | Er, declare, not pass |
| 21:16 | <@Derakon> | Yeah, I got that sorted out. |
| 21:17 | | * Derakon eyes the Ubuntu installation thingy, which is doing some Knight Rider shit with a progress bar. |
| 21:18 | <@Derakon> | Look, if you're doing something and you don't know how long it'll take, there are plenty of better options than pretending to be a progress bar! |
| 21:18 | <@McMartin> | That means "I'm getting conflicting sensor data but there should be a progress bar here" |
| 21:18 | <@Derakon> | I'm running the Ubuntu install. |
| 21:18 | <@McMartin> | The old-school-Cylon thing is the equivalent to Apple's candy-cane progress bar. |
| 21:19 | <@Derakon> | Ahh, now it appears to actually be measuring progress. |
| 21:19 | <@Derakon> | Oh, idea I had -- tradeoffs between robustness and power/efficiency. |
| 21:20 | <@Derakon> | For example, your starting radar is pretty basic stuff. After a bit you could upgrade to a similar radar that's very hard to break, or you could get the advanced-but-fragile one, which has a better response time and tells you what the bogeys are, but goes haywire after taking marginal damage. |
| 21:20 | <@McMartin> | You get X upgrade points at start, and a few more for each level you beat. |
| 21:20 | <@McMartin> | Kai Lord style. |
| 21:20 | <@Derakon> | Heh. |
| 21:21 | <@McMartin> | (Or, more on-point, [PCA]-Robots style) |
| 21:21 | <@Derakon> | The plan actually was to have the enemies drop spare parts. |
| 21:21 | <@Derakon> | Perhaps base research can be done based on levels completed. |
| 21:24 | <@Derakon> | Wow my computer is slow. |
| 21:25 | <@Derakon> | I guess OS installers don't feel the need to play nice with system resources. |
| 21:25 | <@Derakon> | (And I'm aware how flawed that logic is, thanks) |
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| 22:31 | <@Derakon> | One of the guys on TASVideos wrote up his thoughts on Fusillade, and basically none of them were good. |
| 22:32 | <@Derakon> | At least he was detailed about it. |
| 22:32 | <@Derakon> | Now, his background includes a lot of knowledge of more traditional bullet hell games. |
| 22:33 | <@Derakon> | My concern is what people not familiar with that subgenre think of the game, since that's a much larger audience... |
| 22:33 | <@Derakon> | (Which isn't to say I'll ignore his feedback) |
| 22:33 | | * TheWatcher nods |
| 22:34 | <@TheWatcher> | It's something to look at, but not something to feel discouraged over |
| 22:34 | <@Derakon> | Well, the really big thing to be concerned about is "Why would you pay for Fusillade when there are a bunch of free games that do it better?" |
| 22:34 | <@Serah> | I concur. |
| 22:36 | <@UndeadAnno> | Derakon: "I have too much money and need to spend it all right now!" |
| 22:37 | <@Derakon> | Selene shouldn't have that problem, at least. I'm not aware of any free 2D freerange scrolling shmups. |
| 22:37 | <@Derakon> | Thanks, Anno. I'm sure there's lots of those people. ¬.¬ |
| 22:37 | <@UndeadAnno> | You'd be surprised. |
| 22:37 | <@TheWatcher> | Derakon: I am, but not in the last, um... 15 years |
| 22:38 | <@TheWatcher> | maybe 10 |
| 22:38 | <@UndeadAnno> | Someone I know went, "I have a student loan... loads of disposable income. I know! I'll start playing Magic: the Gathering." |
| 22:38 | | * Derakon facepalms. |
| 22:38 | <@Derakon> | TW: I'm curious -- what game? |
| 22:38 | <@Serah> | <Derakon> Thanks, Anno. I'm sure there's lots of those people. ¬.¬ <- There's me, but I buy cake. |
| 22:38 | <@Serah> | Well, th ingredients. |
| 22:38 | <@UndeadAnno> | And send them overseas. |
| 22:39 | <@Derakon> | Heh. |
| 22:39 | <@TheWatcher> | Derakon: trying to remember the name, a moment while I consult the exocortex |
| 22:39 | <@Serah> | Send what overseas? |
| 22:39 | <@Derakon> | Cake. |
| 22:39 | <@Serah> | Over what sea? |
| 22:39 | <@Serah> | Did you move? |
| 22:40 | <@McMartin> | 14:37 <@Derakon> Selene shouldn't have that problem, at least. I'm not aware of any free 2D freerange scrolling shmups. |
| 22:40 | <@McMartin> | KOBO DELUXE |
| 22:40 | <@McMartin> | Oh god, Kobo. |
| 22:40 | <@Derakon> | ...right, right, Kobo Deluxe. |
| 22:40 | <@Derakon> | I made it to the last level! |
| 22:40 | <@McMartin> | Yes. |
| 22:40 | <@Derakon> | And then died, repeatedly, very fast. |
| 22:40 | <@McMartin> | And then, no. |
| 22:40 | <@McMartin> | I took a screencap~ |
| 22:40 | <@Derakon> | Anyway, Kobo Deluxe will not be serious competition for Selene. They play totally differently. |
| 22:41 | <@Derakon> | (For one, Selene only plays in my head ATM~) |
| 22:41 | <@McMartin> | http://www.stanford.edu/~mcmartin/misc/agh50.png |
| 22:41 | <@UndeadAnno> | Serah: I'm not sure, but I think Derakon lives in Leftpondia. |
| 22:41 | <@Derakon> | I'm a Californian. |
| 22:41 | <@Derakon> | Looks about right, McM. |
| 22:42 | <@Serah> | Well you're all invited for cake. |
| 22:42 | <@Serah> | But it'd have to be in rightpondia. |
| 22:46 | <@TheWatcher> | ... hah, gods, I'd forgotten about Microbes. That game drove me nuts... |
| 22:48 | <@TheWatcher> | Okay, now I just feel old |
| 22:48 | <@TheWatcher> | Fusion was released 21 years ago, eeesh |
| 22:49 | <@Serah> | Well, you are. |
| 22:49 | <@TheWatcher> | http://www.lemonamiga.com/?mainurl=http%3A//www.lemonamiga.com/games/details.php %3Fid%3D2115 - Bullfrog's first game, afaik, which was a viewed from above shooter. Didn't have wraparound, though. |
| 22:49 | | * TheWatcher goes back to trying to find the one he was after originally |
| 22:50 | | * TheWatcher also waves his cane at Serah |
| 22:51 | <@Serah> | Well, I'm old too. |
| 22:51 | <@Serah> | Just not quite a relic. |
| 22:54 | <@TheWatcher> | Hm, okay, the one I was thinking of was Vyrus it seems - that was '91 though >.< |
| 22:55 | <@Derakon> | Vyrus is a motorcycle, apparently. |
| 22:55 | <@Derakon> | Also the first time I've seen this article tag: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vyrus |
| 22:56 | <@TheWatcher> | http://www.lemonamiga.com/?mainurl=http%3A//www.lemonamiga.com/games/details.php %3Fid%3D2204 |
| 22:56 | <@Serah> | Hmm, chaos engine was my first real top down shooter which I spent ages on. |
| 22:56 | <@Serah> | http://abandonia.com/en/games/162/Chaos+Engine%2C+The.html |
| 22:56 | <@UndeadAnno> | I think Attilla's doing an LP of that on the SA forums. |
| 22:56 | <@Derakon> | Anyway, TW, I was commenting more on the availability of free top-down freerange shooters. |
| 22:59 | | * TheWatcher eyes these games, wonders if his copy of Alien Breed: Tower Assault still works |
| 23:02 | <@Serah> | Chaos engine was fun. |
| 23:02 | <@Derakon> | So, where would I find my USB stick on Ubuntu under VirtualBox? |
| 23:02 | <@Derakon> | Or would it not mount? |
| 23:02 | <@Serah> | Well, still is. |
| 23:03 | <@Serah> | I don't know very much about Ubuntu I'm afraid. |
| 23:03 | <@Serah> | <Derakon> Anyway, TW, I was commenting more on the availability of free top-down freerange shooters. <- Kongregate is a pretty big competitor. |
| 23:03 | | UndeadAnno [~farkoff@Nightstar-29197.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: I am Magellan-R-MGE. I see your group is missing a Hygiene officer.] |
| 23:04 | <@Derakon> | This is...a flash games portal? |
| 23:04 | <@Serah> | Yep. |
| 23:04 | <@Serah> | Not only has it many bullethell games, it also has several other top down freerange shooters. |
| 23:05 | <@Alek> | I play on Kongregate. >_> |
| 23:05 | <@Serah> | I do too. |
| 23:05 | <@Serah> | I stopped playing WoW because of kongregate :p |
| 23:05 | <@Alek> | LOL |
| 23:53 | | Tarinaky [~Tarinaky@88.83.110.ns-10776] has quit [Client exited] |
| 23:55 | | Tarinaky [~Tarinaky@88.83.110.ns-10776] has joined #code |
| --- Log closed Fri Feb 20 00:00:42 2009 |