| --- Log opened Wed Apr 29 00:00:37 2020 |
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| 02:17 | <&McMartin> | Vorntastic: Yikes |
| 02:17 | <&McMartin> | Is this something where you can instead linearly iterate over permutations or make a recursive function or something |
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| 09:48 | <~Vornicus> | McM: in Python I'd use itertools.product, honestly. I've got a mesh to make and the mesh I need is such that I have to alternate back and forth between one triangle loading and the other. |
| 10:02 | <~Vornicus> | So it goes for x_cell in range(width): for x_side in (0,1): for x_detail in range(detail): then the same for y. |
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| 12:41 | <&[R]> | Oh thanks yarn FOR DELETING CODE |
| 12:41 | <&[R]> | Simply because I didn't list it in package.json |
| 12:41 | <&[R]> | That's obviously SANE AND PREFERED BEHAVIOR |
| 12:43 | <&[R]> | I guess I get to test recovering files from borg |
| 12:44 | <&[R]> | ... and I can't do that because I'm doing a backup right now |
| 12:44 | <&[R]> | D: |
| 12:51 | <&[R]> | Hokay, so restoring files is fairly slow, seems like random access to individual files in the archive might not be the fastest thing |
| 12:53 | <&[R]> | Woo! Worked like a charm |
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| 13:14 | <@TheWatcher> | [R]: yaay! |
| 13:14 | <&[R]> | Gotta find out why the fuck yarn thought that was a good idea |
| 13:15 | <&[R]> | I moved to yarm from npm to get away from braindead stupidity |
| 13:28 | <~Vornicus> | ah, much better, I found a way I could detect from the actual index, now it's a 2-layer loop. Well 3, because lua doesn't have list.extend |
| 13:29 | <~Vornicus> | https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/474705430434807819/705032918694887464/unknown.png?width=940&height=559 and my first shader works. |
| 13:30 | <&ToxicFrog> | Wobbly! |
| 13:51 | <~Vornicus> | Now I need to get my second shader going, because this was just a test~ |
| 16:32 | < catalyst> | tasty |
| 16:33 | <&McMartin> | Is that a vertex or a pixel shader? |
| 16:33 | <~Vornicus> | Vertex. |
| 16:36 | <~Vornicus> | Next step is a run-once pixel shader for a custom upscale, and then upgrade the vertex shader to be Extremely Mighty. |
| 16:38 | <&McMartin> | <3 |
| 16:38 | < Yossarian> | You're using lua? Why am I seeing (admittedly ancedotal) more Python than Lua? |
| 16:38 | <&McMartin> | I forget if you've seen my Sable fractal vertex shader |
| 16:38 | <~Vornicus> | I'm using Love2D which means lua, yes |
| 16:39 | < Yossarian> | I heard Python 3 totally gummed up the works, too. Akin to C++11 to whatever the 1999 standard is. |
| 16:39 | <~Vornicus> | Python is honestly better than lua for standalone stuff, usually. |
| 16:39 | <~Vornicus> | py3 gummed up the works but that's mostly a long time ago |
| 16:39 | <&McMartin> | Yossarian: C++98 |
| 16:39 | < Yossarian> | Also, if Python 2 is done development, that means the language is complete, yes? |
| 16:39 | <&McMartin> | I'll defend C++11 as a strict improvement |
| 16:39 | <&McMartin> | It's harder to write stdlib quality code in it |
| 16:39 | <&McMartin> | But that's not what you're doing with it |
| 16:40 | <~Vornicus> | Python 3 is also a strict improvement, Fixing a lot of mistakes of the past. |
| 16:40 | < Yossarian> | I'd probably tell you to jump in a lake and write in Delphi. |
| 16:40 | <&McMartin> | Well |
| 16:40 | <&McMartin> | C++11 is also a strict *superset*. |
| 16:40 | <&McMartin> | So I feel like there's nothing it has to prove, tbh |
| 16:41 | < Yossarian> | I keep looking for a good book on Lua but I can't seem to find one or I'm simply braindead. |
| 16:41 | <~Vornicus> | But Python in general is a better language than lua for a lot of things: it's got better standard libraries, an actual solidified method of doing basic shit like classes |
| 16:42 | <&ToxicFrog> | Yossarian: Lua is a small enough language that you can read the entire reference manual in an afternoon and get a decent handle on it, especially if you're only interested in lua-the-language and not liblua-the-C-library |
| 16:42 | <&ToxicFrog> | AFAIK the standard non-reference work for Lua is still "Programming in Lua", although the free edition is quite outdated now; and I've been out of the Lua community for a few years at this point, so I don't know if it's been replaced with something better in the interim. |
| 16:42 | < Yossarian> | When I look at projects built in Lua it's hard to find the entry point for the program, sometimes. I don't know if it is related to how the code is initially called or what |
| 16:43 | <&ToxicFrog> | If it's a stand-alone lua program the entry point is "whatever you expect the user to be passing to /usr/bin/lua" |
| 16:43 | <~Vornicus> | And while that flexibility *can* be an advantage to lua running in an system that you have complete control over, it also means that if you're using somebody else's library, that library often works fundamentally differently |
| 16:43 | <&ToxicFrog> | There's no codified main() |
| 16:43 | <&ToxicFrog> | (I usually name mine "main.lua" and have a shell script that launches it, but that's not universal) |
| 16:44 | <&ToxicFrog> | That said, a lot of lua code is not standalone; it's intended to be loaded and executed by another, larger program. It is, after all, an embedding language. |
| 16:44 | <&ToxicFrog> | In that case the entry point lives in C/++ or Java or C# or something and the lua code may just define a bunch of hooks to be called at defined points in the program or whatever. |
| 16:45 | <~Vornicus> | most lua programs are actually designed to be used by larger things: factorio and WoW and a large number of other systems use lua as a scripting language. |
| 16:45 | < Yossarian> | It's a pretty good scripting language compared to what certain gaming studios cook up at home. |
| 16:45 | <~Vornicus> | love2d is kind of the ...far end of that, where the engine itself does very little. |
| 16:46 | < Yossarian> | Bohemia Interactive has a strange scripting language for Operation Flashpoint to ARMA2 but I haven't checked out ARMA3. |
| 16:46 | < Yossarian> | How is Factorio these days? |
| 16:47 | < Yossarian> | Last time I checked there were artillery pieces. |
| 16:47 | <~Vornicus> | It is the game I've spent the most time in |
| 16:49 | <~Vornicus> | So I'd say it's pretty good |
| 16:50 | <~Vornicus> | It's one of those that often I just kind of wander around and stare at things though~ |
| 16:50 | < Yossarian> | I wish there existed a mod for Factorio or Minecraft where you write coded behavior for entities like bots |
| 16:51 | <~Vornicus> | While not a mod, there's a game called Autonauts that might be up your alley |
| 16:51 | <&ToxicFrog> | Minecraft has that (and it's in lua). And I would be surprised if there's no mod like that for factorio. |
| 16:51 | < Yossarian> | When I was dabbling in the Robotics Club at university there was a "game" where the only control was that of writing a script for the bot. |
| 16:51 | <&ToxicFrog> | Also, yes, autonauts. |
| 16:52 | <&ToxicFrog> | I played a few games like that as a kid; they were all arena-style games. The one I remember most clearly involved programming the bots in TCL. |
| 16:52 | <&McMartin> | P-Robots, woo |
| 16:52 | <&McMartin> | I wonder if I still have my army from high school |
| 16:52 | < Yossarian> | I used to play Minecraft with [R], the mod is ComputerCraft, right? It doesn't offer much in the way of feedback and I imagine a huge script might bog down the server. |
| 16:54 | < Yossarian> | You can automate launches in Kerbal Space Program with two mods like that, the primary one doesn't use Lua though, it uses some BASIC style language but if I wasn't such a lazy shit I could make it understand strictly Lua and other languages. |
| 16:54 | <&ToxicFrog> | You had to actively scan with radar to locate enemy bots, and there was a tradeoff between scan speed and precision; you needed high precision to target enemies accurately, but you couldn't scan and move at the same time, and the longer you remained still the easier it was for enemies to pinpoint you. |
| 16:54 | <&McMartin> | ToxicFrog: This sounds like a cousin to P-Robots |
| 16:55 | <&ToxicFrog> | I ended up writing a bot that used a sort of binary search with the radar along with quick, random dashes to confuse enemy targeting. |
| 16:55 | <&McMartin> | (Which was Pascal) |
| 16:55 | < Yossarian> | Yeah, that's what I wish ComputerCraft had in Minecraft. |
| 16:55 | <&McMartin> | Yeah, I think that's close to one of mine |
| 16:55 | <&ToxicFrog> | McMartin: it used Tk widgets and ran on X11 UNIX; I don't remember the exact name. |
| 16:55 | <&McMartin> | It didn't do as well as Tempest Bot, though, which would try to hurl itself around the edges of the screen shooting inwards |
| 16:55 | < Yossarian> | Attachment for sensor arrays and then implementation for detecting bots based on usage of certain types of sensor packages (like how aircraft combat is done) |
| 16:55 | <~Vornicus> | https://mods.factorio.com/mod/aai-programmable-vehicles Yossarian |
| 16:57 | < Yossarian> | DCS World does the radar thing quite well and helps the layman understand like, a particular RWR system can detect infrared targets (MANPADs or AIM-9 series or enemy radar lock) |
| 16:58 | < Yossarian> | although I haven't really played it but I binged a lot of tutorials |
| 16:58 | <&ToxicFrog> | Aha, it was just called "tclrobots": https://github.com/jonasferry/TclRobots |
| 16:58 | <~Vornicus> | I've been thinking about a thing that does this, but it's definitely bluesky at this point |
| 16:58 | <&McMartin> | I think the original was called "Robots" and then the rest were all "LanguageRobots" |
| 16:59 | | * Vornicus ..., thinks of another thing to put on the list of programs Vash could make |
| 16:59 | < Yossarian> | Awhile ago I was also mulling the idea of using OpenCV for a combat flight sim like IL-2 Sturmovik 1946 for the detection (visual) of enemy craft and then a whole host of code on how to guess where a passing plane would be, what movement to make, gunnery specifics |
| 16:59 | <~Vornicus> | ROBOT FINDS KITTEN |
| 17:00 | <&ToxicFrog> | Here's one with a screenshot: https://corewar.co.uk/tclrobots/ |
| 17:00 | <&ToxicFrog> | (of a more recent version than I played! I think we just had 1.0. It didn't have fancy coloured radar arcs.) |
| 17:00 | <&McMartin> | I remember that the more advanced P-Robots let you configure the hardware on the robots |
| 17:00 | < Yossarian> | That screenshot looks very similiar to what we were using in the Robotics Club except we only did it once in an EE lab with projector |
| 17:01 | <&McMartin> | So you could get superior engines that would make you go fast straight but make it harder to turn, or whatnot |
| 17:01 | < Yossarian> | Oh man, now imagine being able to do this but in space. |
| 17:01 | < Yossarian> | Like a space style game but with elements of minecraft |
| 17:01 | <~Vornicus> | ...Space Engineers? |
| 17:02 | <&ToxicFrog> | Yeah, it sounds like you're describing Space Engineers. |
| 17:02 | <~Vornicus> | No Man's Sky? Astroneer? |
| 17:02 | <&ToxicFrog> | NMS doesn't have the "assemble ship out of individual blocks" element, and neither does Astroneer |
| 17:02 | <~Vornicus> | True |
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| 17:03 | < Yossarian> | I've been wanting to reverse engineer the memory map of Egosoft's X2 or X3 and write code to make it multiplayer... but my desktop only has 4GB of RAM so loading a screenshot of a particular game state while running the game is difficult. |
| 17:03 | <&McMartin> | I think Space Engineers does though |
| 17:03 | <&ToxicFrog> | It does, yes. |
| 17:03 | <~Vornicus> | From what I've seen -- granted this is SovietWomble's bullshittery series but still -- yes you do design your own ships |
| 17:04 | <&ToxicFrog> | I've played it extensively. |
| 17:04 | <&ToxicFrog> | Ships are assembled out of individual blocks and you have to actually pay attention to e.g. thruster placement; there's some automatic balancing but that won't help you if you don't have anything positioned in a way that can control the axes you want. |
| 17:04 | < Yossarian> | And then the ability to write custom code for ships and have upgrades and behaviors with resource collection... like, kinda turning it into a resource collection / RTS, in a way. |
| 17:04 | < Yossarian> | This is Space Engineers? |
| 17:05 | < Yossarian> | I should get that. I should actually upgrade my laptop and get an eGPU setup going. |
| 17:05 | <&ToxicFrog> | There's no builtin programming support but there are mods that add programmable computer cores and people have used them to implement things like AI-controlled escort ships or cooperative drone swarms. |
| 17:05 | <&ToxicFrog> | Yes, this is space engineers. |
| 17:06 | <&ToxicFrog> | Oh wait no, there's built in programming support now: https://www.spaceengineerswiki.com/Programming_Guide |
| 17:07 | < Yossarian> | X2 an X3 have pre-defined ship behaviors and an internal scripting system but my main thing with Egosoft's X series is to make it multiplayer - but |
| 17:08 | < Yossarian> | even with limited memory like I had problems even changing my current piloted ship's speed |
| 17:08 | <~Vornicus> | from what *extremely* little I know about the X series is, isn't multiplayer X just... Elite Dangerous and/or EVE |
| 17:08 | < Yossarian> | either the windows memory editing tools suck or I suck at using them |
| 17:08 | < Yossarian> | It isn't |
| 17:08 | < Yossarian> | None of the X series games are multiplayer but the universe is laid out in XML files and well documented in how they're layed out |
| 17:09 | <&ToxicFrog> | EVE is the closest in what you have scope to do but the controls/gameplay experience are totally different, since you aren't really flying your ship, you're giving your ship orders that the abstract crew carries out |
| 17:09 | < Yossarian> | I assume loading of the XML files into the engine is somewhat similiar to how they're laid out |
| 17:09 | <&ToxicFrog> | ED, AFAIK, doesn't have the whole building space stations/hiring fleets/running an entire economy aspect, AFAIK. |
| 17:09 | < Yossarian> | even in-game scripts are loaded objects |
| 17:10 | < Yossarian> | and in an ideal MP hack of X3, have load balancing of sectors between several servers |
| 17:11 | < Yossarian> | maybe I should stop being a pussy and just get buftab.vim and write code? |
| 17:11 | < Yossarian> | but this space engineers sounds pretty good; I've been messing with Jagged Alliance 2, Sirtech released the source code and there are lots of improvements since the 90s |
| 17:11 | <~Vornicus> | misread as butt fab |
| 17:11 | < Yossarian> | silkworm missle fabv |
| 17:11 | < Yossarian> | silkworm missle fab |
| 17:12 | < Yossarian> | X3:AP's single player missions got really buggy since I've last played. |
| 17:13 | < Yossarian> | I figured I'd relearn the game by playing the lost Terran quest line. I'm supposed to kill this guy in Teladi space but I don't want the Teladi hating me. I know he has illegal cargo but... I don't have the reputation to buy a freight scanner to catch him with space weed |
| 17:14 | < Yossarian> | Also JA2 v1.13 has multiplayer. Destructable roof but no destructable walls. Such an old project it is hosted on sourceforge or on their own svn repo. |
| 17:15 | < Yossarian> | They've got deathmatch, cooperative, new aiming system which makes all the shooting harder like one might argue is how real life is. |
| 17:16 | < Yossarian> | they improved upon the inventory system and I'd argue that if one can't figure out a isometric engine for that kinda combat that one could crib the one from Jagged Alliance 2's source. |
| 17:16 | < Yossarian> | But I really want destructable walls and more wall materials ought to be able to be shot through |
| 17:17 | < Yossarian> | Not sure how much money JA2 Gold is on Steam or on GoG.com but you need the assets if you want to play the mod |
| 17:18 | < Yossarian> | or another good idea is turning Minecraft into the first Battlefield game, Battlefield 1946? I remember the demo well, Wake Island. |
| 17:18 | < Yossarian> | 64 players in Minecraft with aircraft and such things, that sounds like fun. |
| 19:15 | <@Alek> | everything redstone-powered? :P |
| 19:16 | < Yossarian> | shit, sorry, my phone overheated and crashed |
| 19:16 | < Yossarian> | but this motel finally has internet |
| 19:16 | <~Vornicus> | your FACE is redstone-powered |
| 19:17 | < Yossarian> | Alek: maybe redstone powered. I don't recall Minecraft having oil as a default resource but I'm sure it could be created |
| 19:19 | <~Vornicus> | I know I've played an MC mod with oil in it |
| 19:19 | < Yossarian> | and then one could have your usual maps generated precedrually or maps with like small cities with special objects for extracting required material for running machines (tanks, etc) |
| 19:19 | <~Vornicus> | and also giant tanks, which were amazing |
| 19:20 | < Yossarian> | [R] had a really cool mod that you could surround blocks with a special block and in the center of this block was like, a hosting thing and you could teleport the blocks to a map location. I was trying to create kinda like a flying small city or Kami's Place I guess from Dragonball but then stopped playing altogether |
| 19:20 | < Yossarian> | seriously? |
| 19:21 | <~Vornicus> | Yeah, I... don't know the status of mods in minecraft nowadays, how many times shit's broken, etc |
| 19:21 | < Yossarian> | there is a MMOFPS called World War II Online, it came out in the early 2000s, it still runs and you can get into tanks and stuff with multi-crew w/ friends or aircraft... |
| 19:23 | < Yossarian> | the best experience I had is I was flying I think the very basic allied French aircraft, might be modeled on the US P-36, but there was a conflict in this town and I was doing Close Air Support for about two hours straight. |
| 19:23 | < Yossarian> | I would do flight patterns and scout out enemy tanks, after action report actually showed that a strafe run at a tank managed to damage the loader or gunner, best is when you spot infantry advancing and you can strafe them. Good times. |
| 19:24 | < Yossarian> | I don't think I ran out of ammo or if I did, that's when I called it quits. |
| 19:24 | < Yossarian> | Flew back to the aerodrome. |
| 19:24 | < Yossarian> | Aircraft don't have much ammo in them, I had to be very careful with my bursts. |
| 19:25 | < Yossarian> | They even brought trucks with smaller caliber AA guns towed to try and shoot at me but our guys in the ground took care of that. |
| 19:27 | < Yossarian> | It's one of those games that where getting to the battlefield can be a chore but if you have a good in-game experience, you are not likely to forget. First playing I think in one of the French interwar period tanks, my uncle was co-crewing with me and we saw an approaching Axis tank and we freaked out and we came up with the idea of putting the gun in the down position like we were disabled. |
| 19:27 | < Yossarian> | It worked. |
| 19:27 | < Yossarian> | Guy took a look, didn't shoot, went past and got into the gunner's seat and hammered away at his rear. |
| 19:29 | < Yossarian> | With a free account you don't really have access to the nice gear or tanks but all the resources are shared and there is a logistics network anyway. There are players in the high command and they determine what gear is next to be researched. Last time I did play they introduced paratroopers and that was fun, get a SMG and the guy who is flying the transport determines where you go... dropping |
| 19:29 | < Yossarian> | into a town though, good chance you get shot |
| 19:29 | < Yossarian> | situational awareness, you know? |
| 19:30 | < Yossarian> | they added to where special trucks allow other players to spawn from it, so you don't have to hitch a ride on a tank or get someone to spawn a truck and ride there manually |
| 19:31 | < Yossarian> | which is still an option for a good sneak attack, capturing towns usually involves getting into a bunker where the slits have very hard to aim grenades in there, very hard tosses |
| 19:32 | < Yossarian> | one time I spawned as a rifleman and I was just walking and I saw an enemy walking kinda the opposite direction; there was no war activity on the map and I put him in my iron sights and got 'em |
| 19:34 | < Yossarian> | But it's an interesting game, I think they've basically always got the free or trial mode; you can't advance to much... some of the early advancements for infantry weapons are nice (binoculars, anti-tank gun), or light tanks like the M8 Greyhound |
| 19:34 | < Yossarian> | playing as a towed weapon is nice too |
| 19:35 | < Yossarian> | I just don't have a group of friends who are really interested in playing these sorts of games. Nobody even wants to play IL-2 1946 or JA2 multiplayer (better than FO Tactics supposedly). They've gone soft. |
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| 22:03 | < Kizor> | https://imgur.com/gallery/01u3npp |
| 22:10 | <&[R]> | <Yossarian> I wish there existed a mod for Factorio or Minecraft where you write coded behavior for entities like bots <-- ComputerCraft turtles, OpenComputers has something too, OpenPeripherals Robots are even more so. ThaumicTinker has a golem-ComputerCraft bridge (no idea how much control you have over the golem though). |
| 22:14 | <&[R]> | <Yossarian> [R] had a really cool mod that you could surround blocks with a special block and in the center of this block was like, a hosting thing and you could teleport the blocks to a map location. I was trying to create kinda like a flying small city or Kami's Place I guess from Dragonball but then stopped playing altogether <-- Redstone In Motion? I can't think of any mod that was in that pack that did that. Unless I actually put in Blood Magic before you quit |
| 23:26 | | bluefoxx [fuzzylombax@Nightstar-gmbj85.vs.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 23:40 | | Emmy [Emmy@Nightstar-9p7hb1.direct-adsl.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] |
| 23:47 | < Yossarian> | [R]: do you still fuck around with minecraft? |
| 23:48 | | bluefoxx [fuzzylombax@Nightstar-gmbj85.vs.shawcable.net] has joined #code |
| --- Log closed Thu Apr 30 00:00:39 2020 |