| --- Log opened Tue Sep 22 00:00:00 2015 |
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| 03:43 | <@mac> | TheWatcher: Isn't that what manpages are supposed to be, though? A reference, not a tutorial? |
| 03:56 | <&Derakon> | Mac: it varies depending on the man page, but many of them are sufficiently self-explanatory as to be usable by the uninitiated. |
| 03:57 | <&Derakon> | I learned a lot about *nix by using the apropos command and reading manpages back in college. |
| 03:57 | < Turaiel> | Though you generally do need a POSIX background to use them |
| 03:57 | < Turaiel> | well, at least |
| 04:18 | <@mac> | Derakon: Yeah, but I've always been told that sort of thing is a 'nice to have' - and that only as long as making it comprehensible to newbies does *not* compromise the core functionality of a complete but concise reference. |
| 04:23 | <@mac> | E.g. 'I don't want a detailed explaination of what every command flag does and does not do and what its for, just quick list of what options exist.' |
| 04:24 | <&Derakon> | I have seen very few man pages that qualify as "quick lists". |
| 04:25 | <@mac> | Er, not the manpage as a whole. I'm sepcifically talking about the list of command-line options. |
| 04:25 | <@mac> | I.e. "-V: Turns on verbose mode" |
| 04:26 | <@mac> | Vs. "-V: Turns on verbose logging mode, in which a message is printed to STDOUT (standard output) at the start and end of every step in the operation, to aid in tracking and troubleshooting." |
| 04:27 | <@mac> | The first is what I've been taught a manpage should look like - but it's only useful if you already know what 'verbose mode' is. |
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| 04:28 | <@mac> | (Note: In that particular case, knowing what 'versobe mode' is is a matter of basic *NIX familiarity. But I was also taught that other options, even ones that are not standard terminology, should be similarly brief.) |
| 04:29 | <&Derakon> | Yeah, so the problem with the git man pages is that they universally assume a complete understanding of every aspect of git. |
| 04:30 | <&Derakon> | Which is a huge, complex system. |
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| 04:30 | <&Derakon> | Many (most, even) man pages contain information sufficient for you to glork the meaning of the command from context. |
| 04:30 | <&Derakon> | Not git. |
| 04:31 | <~Vornicus> | What I'd want is |
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| 04:45 | <~Vornicus> | -V: turn on verbose mode (print each directory as it is entered); -VV turn on very verbose mode (print each file as it is scanned); -VVV turn on crazy verbose mode (print each test as it is applied) |
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| 11:21 | | * TheWatcher ARGHS |
| 11:21 | <@TheWatcher> | How do you fuck up date handling so thoroughly?! |
| 11:27 | <@TheWatcher> | Oh, wait, that's how: do no user input! |
| 11:28 | | * TheWatcher headdesks |
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| 11:48 | <@gnolam> | <TheWatcher> How do you fuck up date handling so thoroughly?! |
| 11:48 | <@gnolam> | By being American? :P |
| 11:49 | <&ToxicFrog> | Date handling is one of the Two Hard Problems along with naming, cache invalidation, and counting, IMO |
| 11:56 | < catadroid> | date handling is harder when you haven't learned the common social protocols |
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| 14:12 | | Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: Xon, @JustBob, @Namegduf, grindhold, @mac, @Crossfire, @ToxicFrog, @jeroud, @jerith, tripflag |
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| 15:06 | | * TheWatcher returns from labs |
| 15:07 | <@TheWatcher> | Actually, this is worse than just "different locales use different date systems" |
| 15:07 | <@TheWatcher> | This is "let the users enter whatever they feel like for dates" |
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| --- Log closed Tue Sep 22 23:50:40 2015 |
| --- Log opened Tue Sep 22 23:56:37 2015 |
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| --- Log closed Wed Sep 23 00:00:16 2015 |