| --- Log opened Thu Dec 05 00:00:25 2013 |
| 00:34 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
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| 06:19 | <@Azash> | http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/nsa-tracking-cellphone-loc ations-worldwide-snowden-documents-show/2013/12/04/5492873a-5cf2-11e3-bc56-c6ca9 4801fac_print.html |
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| 08:00 | <@froztbyte> | sigh |
| 08:00 | <@froztbyte> | I might have to C(Python) it up today |
| 08:00 | <@froztbyte> | :( |
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| 12:11 | <@gnolam> | https://twitter.com/HardSciFiMovies/status/407572381104742401 |
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| 20:51 | < McMartin> | http://kingjamesprogramming.tumblr.com/ |
| 20:54 | <@TheWatcher> | That looks vaguely akin to the Scripture of the Master Programmer an old uni friend and I started on years ago |
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| 21:12 | | abudhabi- is now known as AnnoDomini |
| 21:36 | | * AnnoDomini tries to get this silly bouncer thingy to replay the log of what happened while he was away. |
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| 21:48 | < RichyB> | TheWatcher, I don't suppose that might be online anywhere? |
| 21:53 | <@TheWatcher> | I still have a few in my random sig file, but the original is lost to the river of history. |
| 21:54 | | * TheWatcher digs out the ones he still has |
| 21:55 | <@TheWatcher> | http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/600 |
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| 21:56 | <&ToxicFrog> | "symbols, whose values are looked up in the court of the LORDâs glory." |
| 21:56 | <&ToxicFrog> | http://kingjamesprogramming.tumblr.com/ |
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| 21:57 | | * Tamber grins at Designers 2:146-148. |
| 21:57 | | Kindamoody|autojoin is now known as Kindamoody |
| 21:59 | < RichyB> | TheWatcher, thank you! |
| 22:01 | <@TheWatcher> | (I do note that none of them were ever intended to be actually serious or anything. Except Principles 1:46. |
| 22:01 | <@TheWatcher> | ) |
| 22:01 | < RichyB> | "Users are specialists. Unfortunately, not in computers." is beautiful and should be stapled to the face of every tool who ever belittled someone for not understanding their computer. |
| 22:02 | < RichyB> | TheWatcher, I would prefer that Principles 1:32 be filed under Arguments, since I think it's a deliberate flamewar incitement. :) |
| 22:03 | <@Tamber> | I still firmly believe that there is no excuse for not learning to type, if your job involves entering information into a computer all day. |
| 22:03 | < RichyB> | TheWatcher, er, not 1:32, 1:24. |
| 22:04 | <@TheWatcher> | heheh |
| 22:04 | < RichyB> | â¦or maybe not. Nah, it's good where it is. |
| 22:04 | <@TheWatcher> | Tamber: a-bloody-men to that one |
| 22:06 | < RichyB> | I suppose that since using a strong static type system allows me to offload some correctness checking from my own brain to the computer, it does indeed let me write correct programs with a weaker mind than would otherwise be required. |
| 22:06 | <@Tamber> | It is damned cringeworthy to watch people hunting and pecking, when it's their job to enter info into a computer. There is a great struggle within me when I behold such. |
| 22:07 | < RichyB> | Analogously, shooting someone in the face permits me to slay them with significantly less requisite badasstitude than would be required of me if I were throwing the bullets really hard with my hands. |
| 22:07 | < RichyB> | Tamber, I agree. I have no clue how to convince people of this. |
| 22:08 | <@Tamber> | (I'm not asking for 140+ WPM, or anything like that; that'd be unreasonable. But, y'know, better than *pak* *pak* *pak* *pak* *pak*) |
| 22:08 | | * Tamber continues grumping and grumbling in the corner. |
| 22:08 | < RichyB> | What I have tried telling people before is that learning to type is easy, pays dividends surprisingly fast and will delay them from developing RSI. |
| 22:09 | <@Tamber> | Oh, but I *love* that little tingly *pling* in my wrists when I bend my hands so! |
| 22:10 | < RichyB> | I think I need some kind of free touch-typing-tutor app online to point people at, because going out and buying a copy of Mavis Beacon is a pretty big barrier to action in most peoples' minds. |
| 22:10 | <@TheWatcher> | Yeah, we have a secretary in work who hunt&pecks. She's worked there 20-odd years. I have no idea how |
| 22:10 | <@Tamber> | Inertia. |
| 22:10 | <@Tamber> | 20 years thereof. :p |
| 22:11 | < RichyB> | A javascript version of KTouch might be the best thing. |
| 22:11 | <@TheWatcher> | (this is the one who had to be handheld through CODICIL WINTER HILL, with here writing down every step /including the password she has to enter in the login form/) |
| 22:11 | <@TheWatcher> | s/here/her |
| 22:12 | <@TheWatcher> | I have been assured by other members of staff that yes, she really needs to put that down, or she gets stuck on the login form |
| 22:17 | | * iospace pats TheWatcher |
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| 22:28 | <@Alek> | I think that the older people in the workforce have LESS excuse for hunt-and-pecking, since some of them learned on a typewriter. And many schools, in fact, offered typewriting courses. As requisites. |
| 22:28 | <@Alek> | at least in the more urban areas. but less ghetto. |
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| 22:59 | <@Tarinaky> | Alek: Equally though those typing courses probably would have been pushed on some genders over others :p |
| 22:59 | <@Alek> | doesn't invalidate my point, though. |
| 23:00 | <@Tarinaky> | It does a little unless you want to feed out more specifics. |
| 23:16 | | * Azash waves for someone who has done academia (McMartin?) |
| 23:17 | <@Azash> | I think I just finished planning out my MSc |
| 23:17 | <@Azash> | Mobile platform security 3, software security 4, distributed systems 4, dist. sys. project 2, overlay/p2p networks 4, software factory 10, internet protocols 4, software architecture 5, crypto 4, intro to ML 4, compilers 4, code generation 4, mobile middleware 3 |
| 23:17 | <@Azash> | Does this look well-rounded enough if one wants to have a security focus or am I missing some area? |
| 23:20 | <&ToxicFrog> | RichyB: Typing of the Dead~ |
| 23:20 | <&ToxicFrog> | Except that's not free. |
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| 23:24 | <@Namegduf> | It's weird how cheap software becomes when you start assigning a sensible value to your time. |
| 23:32 | < Vorntastic> | No kidding. My last software job, the software we made cost clients $10k plus 1% of revenue and that was xonsidered quite cheap. |
| 23:32 | <@Alek> | http://i.imgur.com/Gcto95Z.png |
| 23:35 | <@Reiv> | Alek: Typing was for receptionists. |
| 23:35 | <@Reiv> | It was not for Real Employees. |
| 23:43 | < RichyB> | ToxicFrog, uh? The issue is not price and it isn't interface, it's that I want something to point people to where the barrier to entry is not "buy this software" or even "download and run this program" but "just visit this URL" |
| 23:44 | < RichyB> | Much easier to convince people to try, I think. |
| 23:49 | <&ToxicFrog> | Aah. |
| 23:50 | < RichyB> | TypeRacer exists too |
| 23:51 | < RichyB> | the thing about ktouch is that it has this mode where it patiently explains which fingers to put where |
| 23:52 | < McMartin> | Azash: Looks OK. ML's a good language to know, too, though you're unlikely to use it much in industry. |
| 23:52 | < McMartin> | It does have a couple features that Spoil You Forever, but so it goes~ |
| 23:52 | <@Azash> | McMartin: Machine learning |
| 23:53 | <&ToxicFrog> | I should learn ML one of these days. |
| 23:53 | <@Azash> | I have to admit I've never heard of ML |
| 23:54 | < McMartin> | OCaml and SML are the two major dialects at this point. |
| 23:54 | < McMartin> | It's where Haskell stole its function definition syntax. ;-) |
| 23:54 | <@Azash> | Ah, those I have heard about |
| 23:54 | <@Azash> | Hee |
| 23:54 | < McMartin> | "ML" is the, er, superclass. |
| 23:54 | < McMartin> | (Haskell is *not* an ML, though.) |
| 23:55 | <@Azash> | Is OCaml worth a shot? |
| 23:56 | < McMartin> | Hmm. |
| 23:56 | < McMartin> | It's uglier, but the compiler is "better" (produces faster, more portable code) |
| 23:56 | < McMartin> | I've written a handful of actual programs in it that I used for things. |
| 23:56 | < McMartin> | This is more than I can say for a lot of mostly-esoteric languages. |
| 23:58 | <@Azash> | I gave ML a quick look on wikipedia and saw it say it has side effects, which is pretty much my tiebreaker :b |
| 23:58 | < McMartin> | All ML dialects have side effects. |
| 23:58 | < RichyB> | Azash, <3 |
| 23:59 | < McMartin> | OCaml's big ugliness is that it doesn't properly handle a numeric tower; SML's big ugliness is that it's bad at deriving comparators for user types. |
| 23:59 | <@Azash> | Numeric tower? |
| 23:59 | < McMartin> | So, ML has type inference |
| --- Log closed Fri Dec 06 00:00:08 2013 |