--- Log opened Sun Oct 20 00:00:47 2013 00:37 ktemkin[awol] is now known as ktemkin[grading] 00:51 < JustBob> For you code nuts: http://i.imgur.com/g0Zgf6q.jpg 01:03 Vornicus [vorn@ServerAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has quit [[NS] Quit: Leaving] 01:03 <@Alek> ouch 01:03 celticminstrel [celticminst@Nightstar-90d86201.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #code 01:03 mode/#code [+o celticminstrel] by ChanServ 01:13 < [R]> lolwut 01:13 < [R]> People serious still use floppies? 01:14 <&McMartin> Welcome to Japan 01:14 <&McMartin> Here is your free Japan 01:19 <@Namegduf> Where's that picture from? 01:30 <@Azash> JustBob: Imagine the poor IT guy 01:49 <@Alek> knowing Japan, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a floppy-feeder machine. 01:51 < [R]> Which you can buy from a vending machine. 01:51 < [R]> Usually with a used-panties VM right beside it. 01:52 <@Azash> But are there vending machines operated by prepaid floppies you get from your bank? 01:52 <@Azash> If not, it must happen 01:52 <@Azash> The new rival for NFC, FDC 02:11 <@Alek> it's nice how the smartphone is so all-in-one. did anyone even come close in predicting it? 02:11 <@Alek> communication, library, wallet, entertainment center, and SO much more. 02:12 <@Namegduf> People have tried to do it with PDAs before. 02:12 <@Namegduf> It is just that they kind of sucked. 02:13 Kindamoody[zZz] is now known as Kindamoody 02:16 <@Alek> the tech wasn't quite there to do it comfortably. 02:17 < JustBob> My Palm LifeDrive worked fine for all-in-one. 02:17 <@Alek> you had to plug on attachments for various stuff, like phone, or camera, or etc. 02:17 < JustBob> Aside from, admittedly, the whole camera issue. 02:17 <@Alek> or being the key word. 02:17 < JustBob> Worked fine as a phone as long as you did VOIP. 02:17 <@Alek> now it's all together in a smaller package. 02:17 <@Alek> and don't forget the versatility of touch. 02:18 < JustBob> LifeDrive had that, too. 02:18 <@Alek> then we have the accessories that will connect wirelessly. 02:18 < JustBob> Ayup, bluetooth. 02:18 < JustBob> Really, people just didn't want to /pay/ for it back then. 02:18 < JustBob> The tech existed and it worked fine. 02:18 <@Alek> bluetooth earpiece, google glass, galaxy watch. 02:19 <@Alek> the more specialized stuff, like heart-rate monitor bands. 02:19 <@Alek> etc. 02:19 <@Alek> now it's smaller, Bob. 02:19 <@Alek> and there's more variety. 02:19 < JustBob> Not particularly? 02:20 < JustBob> My lifedrive is roughly the size of my Galaxy S, and half the size of my Note2. 02:20 < JustBob> I mean, I'm not disagreeing the tech's smaller and definitely better, but... It was there ten years ago. 02:21 <@Alek> well, yes. 02:21 <@Alek> it was there. 02:23 < JustBob> It did it comfortably, too. I used my lifedrive more often than my S, though I admit I use my Note more, these days. 02:23 < JustBob> That, and the lifedrive kinda, uh. 02:23 < JustBob> Died. 02:23 < JustBob> Miserably. 02:24 < JustBob> After six deployments and being beaten around for eight years. :p 02:46 Vornicus [vorn@ServerAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has joined #code 02:46 mode/#code [+qo Vornicus Vornicus] by ChanServ 02:48 himi [fow035@Nightstar-5d05bada.internode.on.net] has quit [Operation timed out] 03:02 himi [fow035@Nightstar-5d05bada.internode.on.net] has joined #code 03:02 mode/#code [+o himi] by ChanServ 03:11 himi [fow035@Nightstar-5d05bada.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] 03:24 himi [fow035@Nightstar-5d05bada.internode.on.net] has joined #code 03:24 mode/#code [+o himi] by ChanServ 03:26 VirusJTG [VirusJTG@Nightstar-09c31e7a.sta.comporium.net] has quit [[NS] Quit: Program Shutting down] 03:43 Stalker [Z@Nightstar-b920a19c.cust.comxnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] 03:56 Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody|nap 04:57 Turaiel[Offline] is now known as Turaiel 05:12 * Alek has a note 3, LOVES it. 05:12 <@Alek> but yeah, it probably wouldn't last that long. o_o 05:19 Kindamoody|nap is now known as Kindamoody 05:19 Derakon is now known as Derakon[AFK] 05:35 ktemkin[grading] is now known as ktemkin 05:43 < JustBob> Heh. 05:43 < JustBob> I thought about upgrading to a Note3. 05:43 < JustBob> But the Note2 is fine for now. 05:43 < JustBob> Especially since I still have an X201T that works, as well as a pen tablet for my desktop. 05:44 < Syka> wheee 05:45 < Syka> i now know what it feels like to lose horrifically in an elecrion \o/ 05:59 ktemkin is now known as ktemkin[awol] 06:16 celticminstrel [celticminst@Nightstar-90d86201.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [[NS] Quit: And lo! The computer falls into a deep sleep, to awake again some other day!] 06:36 RichyB [RichyB@D553D1.68E9F7.02BB7C.3AF784] has quit [[NS] Quit: Gone.] 06:39 RichyB [RichyB@D553D1.68E9F7.02BB7C.3AF784] has joined #code 07:11 ErikMesoy|sleep is now known as ErikMesoy 07:19 Turaiel is now known as Turaiel[Offline] 07:58 Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody|afk 09:24 Harlow [Harlow@Nightstar-2dbe3d64.il.comcast.net] has quit [[NS] Quit: BED] 09:27 Stalker [Z@Nightstar-b920a19c.cust.comxnet.dk] has joined #code 09:53 thalass [thalass@Nightstar-4ab061cc.bigpond.net.au] has joined #code 09:54 * thalass ponders 09:54 < thalass> When making an SD card for Raspberry Pi usage, it is necessary to set the "boot" flag in gparted first? 09:55 < AnnoDomini> NOOBS worked for me without extra configs. 09:55 < AnnoDomini> Do you have a monitor and stuff or are you trying to run it without? 09:59 < thalass> I'm trying to get ssh set up so i can run it headless, i put raspbian on an sd card (a second noname one, so it's probably that) and i just get the activity light dimly lit, as if there was no card in. 09:59 < thalass> The wiki says that means no boot code has been loaded. 09:59 < thalass> I had the same problem the other day with a different cheap sd card. I guess i'm going to have to get a better one. 10:00 <@froztbyte> paste me a link of the instructions you're following 10:03 < thalass> http://elinux.org/RPi_Easy_SD_Card_Setup#Using_the_Linux_command_line 10:05 < thalass> It says elsewhere that the card has to be FAT32 formatted. 10:05 < xybre> It would be ideal, yes. 10:06 <@froztbyte> gimme a minute 10:06 <@froztbyte> which did you grab, http://downloads.raspberrypi.org/raspbian_latest ? 10:09 * froztbyte prods thalass 10:12 < thalass> Sorry. Had to wrangle the kids. >.< 10:12 <@froztbyte> hehe 10:13 < thalass> Yeah 09-25 is the image i have. sha1 and md5 etc check out, as does a reverse dd'd image file from the sd card to my hdd. 10:14 <@froztbyte> k 10:14 <@froztbyte> it's almost done downloading here 10:16 * thalass nods 10:16 thalass is now known as thalass|afk 10:16 < thalass|afk> augh they're being little bastards tonight. 10:18 < thalass|afk> I tried NOOBS the other day (on a different cheap card), and when i eventually got it to boot it announced that writes were not persisting, and i would need a network connection to download the OS images that ought to have been on the card already. 10:19 < AnnoDomini> thalass|afk: The first time NOOBS boot you need to do a bunch of config stuff, and you need a monitor for that. 10:19 * thalass|afk nods 10:19 < AnnoDomini> Afterwards you can ssh into it. 10:20 < thalass|afk> I'm using a monitor, keyboard and mouse at the moment. I haven't managed to get it to boot properly yet - so no config so far :( 10:21 <@froztbyte> elegua% file 2013-09-25-wheezy-raspbian.img 10:21 <@froztbyte> 2013-09-25-wheezy-raspbian.img: x86 boot sector; partition 1: ID=0xc, starthead 130, startsector 8192, 114688 sectors; partition 2: ID=0x83, starthead 165, startsector 122880, 5662720 sectors, code offset 0xb8 10:21 <@froztbyte> okay 10:21 <@froztbyte> so it looks like when you dd this thing over 10:21 <@froztbyte> it'll have its own partition tables and stuff sorted already 10:21 <@froztbyte> are you removing it immediately after the dd is done? 10:22 < thalass|afk> Nope, the file is still on my hdd. 10:23 <@froztbyte> no I mean 10:23 <@froztbyte> the sd card 10:23 < thalass|afk> Oh. haha. I use the sudo sync command, and then remove it. I checked with df -h, too, to make sure it isn't mounted. 10:25 <@froztbyte> okay 10:25 <@froztbyte> try to check the boot flag with parted 10:25 <@froztbyte> also unplug and replug it 10:25 <@froztbyte> make sure the partitions actually exist 10:26 <@froztbyte> fdisk -l /dev/device/path 10:26 <@froztbyte> or however parted displays things 10:28 < thalass|afk> I get /dev/sdb1p1 being a smaller "W95 FAT32 (LBA) system, and then a /dev/sdb1p2 partition that is "Linux", wich seems to take up the rest of the card. 10:29 * thalass|afk brb. dinner time. 10:41 thalass|afk is now known as Thalass 10:41 < Thalass> omnomnom 11:08 Kindamoody|afk is now known as Kindamoody 11:09 * Thalass tries NOOBS again, on this other card. 11:09 Thalass [thalass@Nightstar-4ab061cc.bigpond.net.au] has quit [[NS] Quit: Leaving] 11:09 thalass [thalass@Nightstar-4ab061cc.bigpond.net.au] has joined #code 11:10 < thalass> oops 11:49 <@froztbyte> thalass: Soz, had to leave to breakfast it up 11:50 <@froztbyte> Those partitions sound right 11:51 Vornicus [vorn@ServerAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has quit [[NS] Quit: Leaving] 11:53 * thalass nods 11:53 < thalass> thanks. It seems the cheap cards i'm trying to use might be the problem. 11:56 Serah [Z@Nightstar-b920a19c.cust.comxnet.dk] has joined #code 11:58 Stalker [Z@Nightstar-b920a19c.cust.comxnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] 12:08 < thalass> Frozt: Question. After you've dd'd the image across to the SD card, are you able to mount the card on the PC and check the contents? One of the troubleshooting steps on elinux.org's troubleshooting guide is to do that, but for me it does not mount - and gparted reports an unknown format. 12:08 Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody|out 12:09 <@Tamber> Did you dd a drive image to a partition, or vice-versa? Either of those might cause problems. 12:14 <@froztbyte> thalass: you should be able to mount it and check 12:14 < thalass> huh. 12:15 < thalass> I dd'd the .img to /dev/sdb1, and the card was empty, with a single FAT32 partition. 12:15 cpux [cpux@Nightstar-98762b0f.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Client closed the connection] 12:18 <@froztbyte> You need to dd it to /dev/sdb 12:18 <@froztbyte> No 1 12:22 * thalass facepalm 12:36 <@gnolam> http://meetings.aps.org/Meeting/DFD13/Event/202554 12:36 <@gnolam> "In response to harsh and repeated criticisms from our mothers and several failed relationships with women, we present the splash dynamics of a simulated human male urine stream impacting rigid and free surfaces." 12:54 < thalass> ... 12:54 < thalass> *snerk* 13:02 VirusJTG [VirusJTG@Nightstar-09c31e7a.sta.comporium.net] has joined #code 13:05 < thalass> whey hey! It mounts this time. >.> 13:05 < thalass> I am such a dumbarse sometimes. :P 13:05 * thalass takes the card to his Pi, tries again. 13:40 < thalass> IT'S ALIVE! 14:51 <@froztbyte> Cool :) 15:07 <@Azash> So apparently Mozilla has developed time travel technology 15:07 <@Azash> Thunderbird just sent me ten years back in time 15:08 <@Azash> "Starting today and lasting until the end of the Halloween celebration on the 5th of November we wish to offer you great deals on either becoming a Member or extending your Membership in Anarchy Online:" 15:12 <@froztbyte> that mail probably doesn't have proper timestamps 15:12 <@froztbyte> thunderbird throws it to the top of the pile 15:44 <@Azash> froztbyte: No, the email is new and all 15:44 <@Azash> I was more joking about my surprise that game was still being hosted 15:53 AnnoDomini [abudhabi@2B12AA.CA225B.06AE83.B2A635] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] 15:54 AnnoDomini [abudhabi@2B12AA.CA225B.06AE83.B2A635] has joined #code 16:21 Derakon[AFK] [Derakon@Nightstar-a3b183ae.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Operation timed out] 16:25 Derakon[AFK] [Derakon@Nightstar-a3b183ae.ca.comcast.net] has joined #code 16:30 celticminstrel [celticminst@Nightstar-90d86201.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #code 16:30 mode/#code [+o celticminstrel] by ChanServ 16:30 thalass [thalass@Nightstar-4ab061cc.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] 16:31 Vornicus [vorn@ServerAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has joined #code 16:31 mode/#code [+qo Vornicus Vornicus] by ChanServ 17:01 * ErikMesoy experiments with the voice recognition on his tablet. 17:01 < ErikMesoy> *presses google audio* "WEBCHAT NIGHTSTAR". 17:01 < ErikMesoy> did you mean: "what did just might start"? 17:03 < Syka> ErikMesoy: rofl 17:03 < Syka> google does "webchat night star" for me 17:03 < Syka> and comes up with the correct link 17:11 < ErikMesoy> How do I "open link in new tab" on tablet? (Chrome, I think) 18:02 <@Alek> longpress, it should pop up options? 18:17 < ErikMesoy> Aha. 18:19 < AnnoDomini> I got "night star web chat". 18:24 < ErikMesoy> Clearly I have an accent. 18:33 <@froztbyte> Syka certainly does too 18:33 < Syka> wut 18:33 < Syka> mine came out correct 18:33 <@froztbyte> I've noticed weirdness with the voice API though 18:33 < Syka> since nightstar isn't actually a word 18:33 <@froztbyte> through some interfaces it works fine, with others it derps out like mad 18:33 <@froztbyte> Syka: that's my point 18:33 <@froztbyte> Syka: you have an accent and for you it worked 18:34 < Syka> i am confused 18:34 < Syka> oh 18:34 < Syka> i have mine set to English (UK) 18:34 <@froztbyte> while for ErikMesoy (who also has an accent) it didn't 18:34 < Syka> not English (Australia) 18:34 < Syka> which assumes you have an easturn austayan accent 18:34 < Syka> if you don't slur your words, it makes mincemeat of it 18:35 < ErikMesoy> Hmm. I set mine to English (US) because that's how I write. I have no idea how I talk. >_> 18:35 < Syka> where are you from 18:35 < Syka> also 18:36 ktemkin[awol] is now known as ktemkin 18:36 < ErikMesoy> I live in Norway. I spent my childhood in South Africa. 18:36 < Syka> you have to end every sentence with a "UNDER GOD" for the english (US) text to speech interpreter 18:37 < ErikMesoy> ...what's ridiculous is that I now said "ONE NATION UNDER GOD" and the tablet got it exactly right. :D 18:37 < Syka> see? i was being serious 18:38 < AnnoDomini> Huh. It got "Mencius Moldbug" right. 18:38 < ErikMesoy> How about "Urbit"? :p 18:38 < Syka> ErikMesoy: you may want to try english uk, or "English (Generic)" 18:38 <@froztbyte> Syka: you're such a fucking troll ;p 18:38 < Syka> there is an English (South Africa) 18:38 < Syka> if you have that accent still 18:38 <@froztbyte> lulz 18:38 < Syka> froztbyte: but I turned out correct! :D 18:38 <@froztbyte> "that accent" == one of 12 18:39 < Syka> froztbyte: pfft 18:39 <@froztbyte> and anyone who says otherwise is being far too hopeful 18:39 < Syka> your country is the size of my backyard, and you're all bad at cricket 18:39 < Syka> :P 18:39 <@froztbyte> Syka: hahaha 18:39 <@froztbyte> also 18:39 < Syka> also rugby (i think you guys play rugby against us?) 18:39 <@froztbyte> I initially read "keyboard" instead of "backyard" 18:39 < Syka> at least, in highschool, i got divetackled by a south african 18:40 <@froztbyte> so I think I may be stepping away from the keyboard soon 18:40 < Syka> froztbyte: at least you're not appreciating the FPS of real life like I was earlier 18:40 <@froztbyte> haha 18:41 < Syka> jenkins is such a pile of shit 18:41 <@froztbyte> it's java 18:41 < Syka> there is a graph for pylint/etc results 18:41 <@froztbyte> just restart it every few days 18:41 <@froztbyte> at minimum 18:41 < Syka> it doesnt matter if its branches 18:41 < Syka> it puts it all in one graph 18:41 < Syka> why? because fuck branches 18:41 < Syka> they didn't exist in 1997 when this software seemed to have been written 18:41 < Syka> they all committed to trunk and liked it 18:42 <@froztbyte> rofl 18:42 <@froztbyte> so uhm 18:42 <@froztbyte> a) jenkins is pretty new-ish 18:42 <@froztbyte> b) branches have been a thing since waaaaaaaaaaaay longer 18:42 <@froztbyte> c) what'd you expect? ;p 18:42 < Syka> froztbyte: jenkins is a rebrand of hudson 18:43 <@froztbyte> Syka: I know 18:44 < Syka> so it's not that new :/ 18:44 < Syka> but yeah 18:44 < Syka> considering looking at buildbot, once the scripts stop scaring me 18:44 <@froztbyte> it's within 5 years or so 18:44 <@froztbyte> buildbot is....weird 18:44 <@froztbyte> I took a look at the pypy buildbot setup 18:44 <@froztbyte> and it honestly took me a good while to get into it 18:44 <@froztbyte> still wanna try get back to it :s 18:45 < Syka> i can look at twisteds setup 18:45 < Syka> and use their build scripts 18:45 < Syka> becausw they do pretty much exactly what I want to do 18:46 < Syka> a twistedchecker run, a trial run, and maybe an extra one for jshint 19:06 Derakon[AFK] is now known as Derakon 19:06 mode/#code [+ao Derakon Derakon] by ChanServ 19:42 cpux [cpux@Nightstar-98762b0f.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #code 19:42 mode/#code [+o cpux] by ChanServ 19:42 Kindamoody|out is now known as Kindamoody 19:45 Turaiel[Offline] is now known as Turaiel 19:48 Vornicus [vorn@ServerAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has quit [[NS] Quit: Leaving] 19:51 < AnnoDomini> C++. What do I use when I want a list (using the word in the common sense here) of things. Don't care about them being numbered. Care about being able to retrieve them selectively based on some criteria. Also want to be able to add and delete elements. 19:51 < AnnoDomini> *? 19:52 Kindamoody is now known as Kindamoody[zZz] 19:57 < AnnoDomini> I'm trying to use std::list. I am trying to understand how iterators work. 19:57 < ktemkin> Look at the list of STL containers. There are tradeoffs depending on which implementation you choose. 19:57 < ktemkin> http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/stl/ <-- Look for a list like that one. 19:58 < ktemkin> IIRC, std::list is based on a doubly-linked-list, so it has constant-time addition and removal, but not fast single-element retreival. 19:59 < ktemkin> If you're always filtering it (by iterating over every element), that'd work fine. 20:00 < AnnoDomini> So how do I filter? I'm absolutely unsure how one does such a thing. 20:02 <&Derakon> I think it's something like this: 20:03 <&Derakon> for (std::list::iterator i = yourList.begin(); i != yourList.end(); ++i) {access element using *i} 20:03 <&Derakon> It has been awhile since I worked with the STL though. 20:05 < AnnoDomini> Ye gods. This could use a macro or something. :P 20:06 < ktemkin> AnnoDomini: look in std::algorithm. There are implementations of common algorithms like that. 20:06 < ktemkin> Things like: http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/algorithm/remove_copy_if/ 20:06 < ktemkin> Or, better: http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/algorithm/copy_if/ 20:14 <@froztbyte> wayttd? 21:07 iospace is now known as io\GO_PACK_GO 21:28 <&ToxicFrog> AnnoDomini: I'm so sorry. 21:29 Turaiel is now known as Turaiel[Offline] 21:31 < AnnoDomini> ToxicFrog: Why are you sorry? WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?! 21:35 <&ToxicFrog> AnnoDomini: because you're trying to do FP-style collection manipulation in C++. 21:36 < AnnoDomini> FP? 21:37 < AnnoDomini> Tarinaky: http://i.imgur.com/PQvEPwc.png 21:37 < AnnoDomini> (They move in realtime, but it's inconvenient to show.) 21:37 <@Tarinaky> AnnoDomini: ? 21:37 < ErikMesoy> use moar gif 21:42 < AnnoDomini> Tarinaky: You were trying to one-up Walmsley, right? 21:42 < AnnoDomini> ErikMesoy: I'd have to make the gif, which is inconvenient. 21:43 <@Tarinaky> Yes. 21:44 <@Tarinaky> What, however, are you doing? 21:45 <&ToxicFrog> AnnoDomini: functional programming. 21:45 <&ToxicFrog> "I have a collection, I want to retrieve some sub-collection that satisfies a predicate" is the filter operation and is trivial to express in e.g. Scala or Lisp (and nearly so in Python) 21:46 < AnnoDomini> Tarinaky: Drawing a star system! 21:46 <&ToxicFrog> And is WELCOME TO TEMPLATE TYPE SIGNATURE HELL in C++. 21:47 <@Tarinaky> AnnoDomini: Let me know if you figure out how to do Keplerian bodies~ 21:47 < AnnoDomini> You mean elliptical orbits? 21:47 <@Tarinaky> Yes. 21:49 < ErikMesoy> AnnoDomini: Tell me how you're doing orbits and I bet I can figure out how to do elliptical ones pretty fast. I'm guessing you should adjust radius based on value of theta, if the way you're doing it has theta. 21:52 < AnnoDomini> ErikMesoy: I'm calculating cartesian coordinates via uniform circular motion formulas. x = r * cos(fi(0) + speed*t). fi(0) is the starting position in radians, speed is radians/second, t is time. 21:52 < AnnoDomini> http://i.imgur.com/OqOfpOh.gif 21:52 < AnnoDomini> Have a gif. 21:53 < AnnoDomini> ToxicFrog: What's a template type signature? 21:53 <@Tarinaky> ErikMesoy: I think he has a function f(r,t,h,k) = (r sin kt+h, rcos kt+h) 21:54 < AnnoDomini> int x = (*j).orbit * cos((*j).offset + game.time * (*j).speed); 21:56 <@Tarinaky> k is probably itself a function of r, can't think because brain though. 21:57 <&ToxicFrog> AnnoDomini: the type signature of a template class or function 21:58 <&ToxicFrog> E.g. template OutputIterator copy_if (InputIterator first, InputIterator last, OutputIterator result, UnaryPredicate pred) 22:01 <@Tarinaky> AnnoDomini: Why isn't the outermost one moving? 22:01 < ErikMesoy> AnnoDomini: r is constant radius here, right? 22:01 < AnnoDomini> Tarinaky: Probably because it rolled poorly in the random generation on speed. 22:01 < ErikMesoy> And y = r * sin(SEE ABOVE),right? 22:02 <@Tarinaky> AnnoDomini: Shouldn't radius and speed be related? 22:02 < AnnoDomini> Tarinaky: I don't know. I'm not an astrophysicist. 22:02 < AnnoDomini> ErikMesoy: Yes. Yes. 22:03 < ErikMesoy> Well, for starters, take the x = r * cos(fi(0) + speed*t) and update it to something like x = FUDGE_VALUE * r * cos(fi(0) + speed*t) to get the really lazy-ass elliptical orbit that doesn't have the sun as a focus. :-p 22:03 < ErikMesoy> (FUDGE_VALUE being around 1, naturally.) 22:03 <&ToxicFrog> AnnoDomini: that gif makes me sad. 22:03 <&ToxicFrog> Tarinaky: yes, they are. Fundamentally. 22:04 <&ToxicFrog> Speed increases with gravitational force, and thus varies inversely with orbital radius. 22:05 < ErikMesoy> Somewhat more seriously, x = r * cos(fi(0) + speed*t) + FUDGE_2 * cos(0.5*fi(0)+speed*t) should give you one-directional ellipsing where FUDGE_2 has a default of 0 22:05 < AnnoDomini> Why does it make you sad, ToxicFrog? 22:05 <@Tarinaky> ToxicFrog: I'm herping a derp. F=Gm^r^-3 for newtonian gravitation... F=ma... so a=Gr^-3... Can't remember how that gives you what the angular speed is. 22:06 < ErikMesoy> If I fucked up that, try x = r * cos(fi(0) + speed*t) + FUDGE_2 * cos(2*fi(0)+speed*t) instead. 22:06 <&ToxicFrog> AnnoDomini: because those orbits are all wrong! 22:06 < AnnoDomini> Are you a wizard? 22:07 < AnnoDomini> (And by that I mean an astrophysicist.) 22:07 < ErikMesoy> AnnoDomini: He's wizard enough to be right. 22:07 <@Tarinaky> You keep using that word. 22:07 < ErikMesoy> Now go test your ellipses. 22:07 <@Tarinaky> I do not think it means what you think it means. 22:07 < AnnoDomini> I'll test them after I update my journal. 22:07 <&ToxicFrog> Tarinaky: I don't remember either, which is why I generally plug the orbital characteristics into some existing piece of software and let that figure whatever other parameters I'm interested in. 22:08 <@Tarinaky> I remember doing something /vaguely/ similar as a problem in like... A-Levels... 22:08 <@Tarinaky> But that was 5 years ago :/ 22:09 <&ToxicFrog> Tarinaky: in practice, this is something you usually calculate for an existing body, so what you do is you calculate the orbital period and radius and pray that the orbit is circular (or nearly so), at which point it's easy~ 22:11 <@Tarinaky> Argh. I'll have to draw a diagram tomorrow and try to figure it out between lectures :/ 22:12 <&ToxicFrog> Tarinaky: what exactly are you trying to do? What starting information do you have? 22:12 <@Tarinaky> ToxicFrog: Right now? Trying to remember what exactly the relationship between r and angular velocity/period is. No more. 22:12 <&ToxicFrog> Er 22:12 <@Tarinaky> Before that, I was watching Star Trek when Anno said my name in this channel. 22:13 <&ToxicFrog> It's harder than that because it also depends on the masses of the bodies involved. 22:14 <@Tarinaky> ToxicFrog: The orbiting mass cancels. 22:14 <@Tarinaky> Only depends on the mass of the barycenter. 22:14 <&ToxicFrog> ...right, but depending on that, you'll get different orbital periods at the same radius. 22:15 <&ToxicFrog> Unless you mean "I have an orbital system and am interested in how the orbital period of one of the bodies changes as I move it closer to/further from the primary" 22:15 <@Tarinaky> I mean: I'm scratching my head and trying to remember of period is linearly related to radius or which power it is. 22:16 <&McMartin> TF: I haven't done any real testing on this yet, but van den Boom just pushed the initial Lua infrastructure into UQM. 22:16 <&ToxicFrog> In which case I think you want the interesting part of Kepler's Third Law, which is that period^2 is proportionate to radius^3 22:16 <@Tarinaky> Ah. Right. I can go to sleep happy then :p 22:17 < AnnoDomini> ErikMesoy: Works. Now I just need to adjust the orbits to match what the bodies actually do! 22:17 <&ToxicFrog> (which is to say that the orbital period is proportionate to \sqrt{radius^3} with a bunch of constant-for-that-system factors lying around0 22:19 <@Tarinaky> F=GMmr^-3 => Mass (of the start) is proportional to r^3... 22:19 <@Tarinaky> That just leaves actual constants lying around... which neither Anno nor me particularly care about. 22:20 <@Tarinaky> *of the star 22:24 < AnnoDomini> Have your ellipses! http://i.imgur.com/c4ZtV0o.gif 22:25 < ErikMesoy> These appear to be the lazy-ass ellipses which don't have the sun as a focus. :p 22:26 < AnnoDomini> I think they do, actually. 22:26 * McMartin has some ellipses. 22:26 <&McMartin> ... 22:26 <&McMartin> ... 22:26 < AnnoDomini> The whole fist? 22:27 < ErikMesoy> AnnoDomini: http://www.mathwords.com/f/f_assets/f23.gif 22:28 < AnnoDomini> ErikMesoy: Oh. These have the Sun in their center. 22:28 < ErikMesoy> In an elliptical orbit, the sun will not be in the centre. It will be at one of the focuses (foci). Easiest explanation is the one above where the foci are the points such that everywhere on the edge has the same sum-distance from the foci. 22:28 < ErikMesoy> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Kepler-first-law.svg 22:29 < AnnoDomini> ErikMesoy: So I need another fudge factor. 22:30 < ErikMesoy> AnnoDomini: Which formula did you use? 22:30 < AnnoDomini> x = r * cos(fi(0) + speed*t) + FUDGE_2 * cos(fi(0)+speed*t) 22:31 < AnnoDomini> I forgot the 0.5 in the second cos. 22:31 < ErikMesoy> Ah. The 0.5 is supposed to make it only stick out to one side, instead of both. 22:32 < AnnoDomini> It's easier for me to draw the orbital path if it's on both. 22:32 < ErikMesoy> It would be even easier to assume orbits are rectangular. :P 22:33 < AnnoDomini> I'm not sure how to draw that. 22:33 < ErikMesoy> I'm joking. Look, you can go for simple circular orbits around the sun, or hard elliptical orbits with the sun as a focus, but elliptical orbits with the sun in the middle are just going to have half of us here staring at you with funny expressions. 22:33 < AnnoDomini> How do you draw an ellipse that sticks to one side with (x,y) and (rx,ry)? 22:36 < ErikMesoy> What's (rx,ry) here? The way I'd do it for ellipses sticking out in arbitrary directions is to use (r, theta) coordinates, converting at the last stage before drawing if necessary, and modding a circular orbit by multiplying r by a factor N where N is a weighted average of 1 and (1+sin(theta)). 22:37 < AnnoDomini> Radii in horizontal and vertical. 22:37 < ErikMesoy> Weighting depends on how eccentric you want the orbit to be; to alter direction, let the second factor in the weighting be (1+sin(theta+k)) where k is chosen in (0,2pi). 22:38 < ErikMesoy> It sounds to me as though (rx, ry) are basically (r cos theta, r sin theta). 22:39 < ErikMesoy> Fiddle with r first, before you turn into cartesian. 22:40 < AnnoDomini> I'm not *turning* it into cartesian, that's what the function takes and I am feeding it r and r + fudge now. 22:41 < ErikMesoy> Umm. When I glare at cos(fi(0) + speed*t), it sounds like basically cos(theta). 22:42 < AnnoDomini> I'm gonna try x + half fudge. 22:44 < AnnoDomini> That didn't work. 22:45 < ErikMesoy> What did it do? 22:45 < AnnoDomini> Not match what I want. 22:45 < AnnoDomini> What's the relationship of rx and the x coordinate of the focus? 22:46 < ErikMesoy> The one focus is supposed to be what the planet goes around, so rx should be calculated from there, I think. 22:46 < ErikMesoy> And the other focus isn't relevant ATM. 22:46 Derakon is now known as Derakon[AFK] 22:47 < ErikMesoy> I should go to bed. I can help more tomorrow if you still care and haven't stopped because you have satisfactorily one-upped someone. 22:47 ErikMesoy is now known as ErikMesoy|sleep 22:51 < AnnoDomini> Perhaphs if I add an epicycle... 22:51 < AnnoDomini> (:V) 22:55 Harlow [Harlow@Nightstar-2dbe3d64.il.comcast.net] has joined #code 22:57 cpux [cpux@Nightstar-98762b0f.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] 22:57 < AnnoDomini> http://imgur.com/VRaEoWm 22:58 < AnnoDomini> There. 22:58 < AnnoDomini> I think those look better. 22:59 <&McMartin> Argh 23:00 himi [fow035@Nightstar-5d05bada.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds] 23:01 * McMartin guesses as what he needs to install to get Lua working 23:01 * McMartin guesses wrong the first time 23:02 <&McMartin> and the second 23:02 < AnnoDomini> Tarinaky: Code included in the description. 23:04 <&McMartin> Where the Hell is liblua 23:04 < AnnoDomini> >Hell 23:05 <&McMartin> Ah, of course, we can't have it in /usr/lib 23:05 <&McMartin> We also can't have anything anywhere named liblua.so 23:06 Harlow [Harlow@Nightstar-2dbe3d64.il.comcast.net] has quit [[NS] Quit: BED] 23:08 <&ToxicFrog> McMartin: what OS? 23:08 <&McMartin> Ubuntu 23:08 <&McMartin> It's named liblua(version number).so and it's in /usr/lib/x84)64-linux-gnu 23:09 <&ToxicFrog> Helpful. 23:09 <&McMartin> Thanks, find 23:10 <&McMartin> Are 5.1 and 5.2 so different? 23:10 <&ToxicFrog> They're API and source incompatible, so yes. 23:10 <&ToxicFrog> Only in small ways, but they aren't drop-in replacements for each other. 23:10 <&McMartin> OK then 23:10 <&ToxicFrog> In general, only point releases are safe to swap out with no source changes of any kind. 23:10 <&McMartin> Time to find out if I need to then rip this all out 23:12 <&McMartin> Oh, I see 23:13 <&ToxicFrog> (luaJIT, on the other hand, is a drop-in replacement for lua 5.1, although it also supports some non-compatibility-breaking extensions) 23:13 <&McMartin> The expectation was that pkgconfig knows about Lua, which on Ubuntu, it doesn't 23:15 cpux [cpux@Nightstar-98762b0f.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #code 23:15 mode/#code [+o cpux] by ChanServ 23:17 <&ToxicFrog> McMartin: the Officially Recommended Way to add lua to a project is just to untar the entire source tree into the project and build that. 23:17 <&ToxicFrog> Specifically to avoid this kind of headache~ 23:18 <&ToxicFrog> (and also so that you don't need to worry about e.g. distro upstream not realizing that minor releases may break compatibility and deciding that the "lua" package is now 5.2 rather than 5.1 or 5.0) 23:18 <&McMartin> Yes 23:19 <&McMartin> I am beginning to see the wisdom of this 23:19 <&McMartin> But right now I can't make it build *anywhere*, so~ 23:23 <&ToxicFrog> Right 23:23 <&ToxicFrog> I suspect the fix for this is not going to be "upgrade the build system" but rather "add lua to the source tree" 23:23 <&McMartin> Yes, and I have now forwarded that to him 23:26 Derakon[AFK] is now known as Derakon --- Log closed Mon Oct 21 00:00:02 2013