code logs -> 2011 -> Wed, 14 Sep 2011< code.20110913.log - code.20110915.log >
--- Log opened Wed Sep 14 00:00:35 2011
00:09 Vornicus-Latens is now known as Vornicus
00:10
< McMartin>
Mindstorms are limited but within their scope extremely powerful.
00:13 * Vornicus gets home, stares vaguely in the direction of his voronoi diagram problem
00:17
< Vornicus>
It would be nice, if I could prove that the outer edges of the 3x3 adjacency graph don't affect the shape of the central cell.
01:00
< McMartin>
Hey, that's a first
01:00 * McMartin finds himself missing a feature from Unity.
01:08
< McMartin>
Also, christ, GTK guys.
01:08
< McMartin>
Look at Qt here
01:08
< McMartin>
QMainWindow extends QWidget extends (QObject, QPaintDevice).
01:09
< McMartin>
Meanwhile, GtkWindow extends GtkBin extends GtkContainer extends GtkWidget extends GtkObject extends GInitiallyUnowned extends GObject.
01:09
< McMartin>
THIS IS A SENSIBLE CLASS HIERARCHY HO YEZ
01:10
<@Tamber>
The GtkWindow is connected to the GtkBin, the GtkBin is connected to the GtkContainer, the GtkContainer is connected to my wristwatch~! ... uhoh.
01:10 Derakon[AFK] is now known as Derakon
01:13
< McMartin>
Still better than wx~
01:18
< Rhamphoryncus>
oh god, it's so baaaaaad.. to go from hellsing to hellsing ultimate... x_x
01:30 shade_of_cpux is now known as cpux
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03:39 Taki^ [Taki@DCDEB4.2A1B13.C83186.864A71] has joined #code
03:46
< Phox>
So, riddle me this. I was thinking of a project to poke at over my break. How feasible do you think it would be to take a picture with your phone, and send it as a fax?
03:47
< Phox>
There's a couple applications I saw that can do that, but they use internet fax servers, so you have to subscribe, and probably pay a fee.
03:47
< Derakon>
You'd have to figure out the fax protocol, but otherwise that sounds pretty feasible.
03:47
< Phox>
Yeah.
03:47
< Phox>
Hmm
03:48
< Phox>
Maybe not, actually.
03:48
< Vornicus>
I don't think there even is a color fax thing.
03:48
< Phox>
No, but I could just take greyscale of black and white
03:48
< Phox>
But, the problem I just realized, is I'm not sure if I can access the incoming data.
03:49
< Phox>
Like, there's a handshake protocol. So, I'd need to be able to take either the audio from the handset, or the data from the channel.
03:49
< Phox>
Not sure how to do that, or if it's even possible, on android
03:50
< Phox>
I've got a feeling it's not possible
03:57
< Phox>
Err....hmm. I guess there's that one application that recognizes a song through the microphone. Maybe it's possible to pull the audio stream
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11:55 * Vornicus eyes very much the answers he's getting off of his voronoi program.
11:55
< Vornicus>
Hooray, curved lines. Somebody shoot me.
11:56
< Vornicus>
also, while the thing said I need quarter-pixel precision, this corner is at a 1/8-pixel position.
11:56
< Vornicus>
(I guess I should have guessed curved lines. I know the definition of a parabola)
12:03
< Vornicus>
...this also answers my other question, which is whether the outside edges matter. They do. WHich sucks, it means I need rather a lot of entries in the dictionary. Now, to figure out exactly how many entries, and then try to calculate the polygons for each entry.
12:09 cpux is now known as shade_of_cpux
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12:20 * Vornicus begins giving his army of robots their marching orders.
12:22 AnnoDomini [annodomini@60F158.737D66.CA1918.CC7562] has joined #code
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12:32
< Vornicus>
3,250 total entries. Now to see about making the list.
12:50
< Vornicus>
OKay. Since I'm dealing only with simplified voronois, where degree-2 nodes are deleted, there's only ever need to look for places where three or more tiles meet. And since I only care about the center tile, I care only about locations where one of the tiles that can go there is the center tile.
12:51
< Vornicus>
THis reduces stuff by a lot.
12:56
< Vornicus>
I don't have any idea how many different places I'll need to check, but I'm pretty sure precalculating the places that might be it will help.
12:59 * Vornicus tries to figure out how to build the structure for a location, so that it's not hard to tell what polygons meet there.
13:16 * TheWatcher attempts to wrangle user authentication using LDAPS from perl
13:17
< Vornicus>
Good god.
13:17 * Vornicus has nightmares about ldap sometimes.
13:17
< TheWatcher>
yeah
13:17
< TheWatcher>
This rate, I'm just going to fall back on my nasty ssh auth
13:18 * AnnoDomini glares balefully at OOorg.
13:18
< AnnoDomini>
The styles, why can't you let me apply a page style to a page, just like that?
13:18
< AnnoDomini>
I don't understand why this isn't a feature - or if it is, why the feature is so obfuscated that I never found it.
13:19
< AnnoDomini>
I'd like to just apply some styles to a page, but no - you can apply a style to the first page, and the style's "next style" attribute determines what style will be next.
13:20
< AnnoDomini>
So if I want, say, eight pages of a specific style, I must make eight separate styles that are the same, and link them up so they resolve in a specific order.
13:20
< AnnoDomini>
This... works, but argh.
13:24
< Vornicus>
No analoque of sections?
13:25
< AnnoDomini>
I'm uncertain what those are.
13:25
< Vornicus>
in MS Word: a "section" is a set of pages with the same layout.
13:26
< AnnoDomini>
I don't know. I'll look for it, when this 50 MB document saves.
13:26
< Vornicus>
When the section changes, so may (among other things) the margins, column layout, page size and orientation, header and footer, and watermarks.
13:30
< AnnoDomini>
Aha! I have found something that looks like what I'm looking for. If you insert a manual break, it lets you choose the next style.
13:33 * TheWatcher hairpulls
13:33
< TheWatcher>
This should not be this fucking hard, ffs.
13:34
< Vornicus>
(in Word at least there are four kinds of section break: those that start the new section immediately on the same page if possible, those that start it on the next page, and those that start on the next even or odd page (two different kinds))
13:38
< TheWatcher>
Right, sod this. I'm not spending all fucking day trying to get this mess to work, time for kludgery
13:38 Red_Queen [Z@Nightstar-3602cf5a.cust.comxnet.dk] has joined #code
13:45
< Vornicus>
OKay. Each entry in a coordinate's distance map has three attributes: the bit that needs to be set for that entry to be active, the tile that that entry is associated with, and the distance from the feature that entry is for.
13:47
< Vornicus>
ANy given coordinate can have mutliple of each tile and bit; each bit usually creates entries for two different tiles, and each tile can have entries from each of up to 8 different bits.
14:06
< Vornicus>
but what I care about really is distance. If I key on that, then for each coordinate I'll check each distance for three hits.
14:13
< Vornicus>
(and while I'm at it I can filter out distances that don't have three possible hits, don't have a possible hit for the center tile, or have a distance higher than to a tile center.)
14:16
< gnolam>
AnnoDomini: it's OO. I gave up on reasonable behavior from that program long ago. :P
14:16
< AnnoDomini>
Mhm.
14:16 AnnoDomini [annodomini@60F158.737D66.CA1918.CC7562] has quit [[NS] Quit: Will be back, though possibly not today.]
14:19
< Vornicus>
well... no. if it doesn't have three possible hits at a distance, that distance can still disqualify higher distances because if that one's too close then the others don't get there.
14:19
< Vornicus>
On the other hand I can disqualify entire tiles if they don't have a way to get three hits at a single distance.
14:19
< Vornicus>
er, entire coordinates.
14:20 * TheWatcher must agree with gnolam in this case. OO/LO is fine for small stuff, but trying to do anything significant (large ducuments, docs with images and/or fancy layout) is a fast route to pain.
14:23
< gnolam>
Except, you, for it being utter shit at pretty much everything.
14:23
< gnolam>
About the only good thing I can say about it is "its equation syntax is fairly LaTeX-like".
14:23
< gnolam>
-you
14:24
< gnolam>
It ignores system localization settings.
14:25
< gnolam>
Speaking of localization, changing it or even the language of a document is a Pain. In. The. Ass.
14:28
< gnolam>
(For those who don't know, that's accomplished by going to Tools->Options->Language Settings->Language, selecting an item in the "Default languages for documents" drop-down list and ticking a checkbox called "For the current document only". Seriously - what the fuck, OpenOffice?)
14:28
< gnolam>
It still, to this day, doesn't handle kerning properly.
14:30
< gnolam>
(Which busts the "fine for small stuff" claim, BTW.)
14:31
< gnolam>
Indices have to be manually updated.
14:33
< gnolam>
Dates in Calc ARRRRRGHGEHG. Did I mention how it fucks up localization?
14:33
< gnolam>
Speaking of Calc, getting charts to work is a complete crapshoot.
14:35
< gnolam>
The installer is utterly /retarded/. Why, exactly, do I have to specify a directory for it to unpack itself? TEMP exists for a reason.
14:35
< gnolam>
(And no, it doesn't even clean up after itself)
14:38
< ToxicFrog>
Doing anything in OO is a pain in the ass.
14:38
< gnolam>
The autostyler is... well, I think it simply works off rand().
14:38
<@Tarinaky>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGTEOrX_I08
14:39
< gnolam>
And all this shit is just off the top of my head. And not the repressed stuff that comes back whenever you actually have to work with it.
14:42
< TheWatcher>
Tarinaky: Pft
14:42 * Tarinaky takes a bow.
14:42
< ToxicFrog>
I recently had to use it for a quick reference sheet thing and hated it even more than I remembered.
14:43
<@Tarinaky>
I finally got the diamond-square algorithm working properly.
14:43
<@Tarinaky>
Which was awesome.
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14:44
< Vornicus>
Woot
14:44
<@Tarinaky>
http://i51.tinypic.com/fc2mu.png << With the maximum roughness.
14:44
< Vornicus>
TF: I recently had to do a quickref sheet for diffeq
14:44
<@Tarinaky>
And it generates decent looking hills when I reduce the parameter :D
14:44
< Vornicus>
It has something like 120 formulas on it.
14:45
< Vornicus>
It really couldn't be done in Word, because you have to click for each individual thing you want to put into your formula, and it does it in a weird order.
14:46
< gnolam>
Tarinaky: ... the "Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath" was a bit unexpected. Methinks the sketch was written by an actual Lovecraft connoiseur. :)
14:47
< gnolam>
+reference
14:47
<@Tarinaky>
Yes.
14:50 Kindamoody|out is now known as Kindamoody
14:51
< Vornicus>
Well that's the point distances. Now I need edge distances. This is going to be painful.
15:00
< gnolam>
(The ratio of people referencing Lovecraft to actually having read Lovecraft is frighteningly high)
15:01
<@Tarinaky>
It depends how you define 'read Lovecraft'.
15:02
<@Tarinaky>
I've only read a couple of short stories.
15:10 * Vornicus dislikes writing this code.
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15:39
< gnolam>
Well, he never wrote any full-length novels.
15:39
< gnolam>
And reading even a single story is more than what most people who reference him have done. :)
15:41
< Simon_Shine>
I have a collection of his novels and I read half of them.
15:52
<@Tarinaky>
FFS I hate X's paste buffers.
15:59
< gnolam>
Oh no, it's perfectly logical that the exact same action should have different effects depending on the input device you use to generate it. :P
16:00
<@Tarinaky>
I don't have a middle mouse button which makes rxvt more or less unuseable for ssh :/
16:00
< gnolam>
(Cue an /actual/ defense from some UNIX apologist in 10... 9...)
16:00
<@Tarinaky>
Err irc
16:04
< Simon_Shine>
Tarinaky, I just don't understand why there needs to be several of them and random programs use random buffers.
16:06
< Simon_Shine>
err, what gnolam said.
16:31 You're now known as TheWatcher
16:33 * TheWatcher readsup, notes he has Lovecraft's entire library of stories and poetry, doesn't have his letters (he was a prolific and interesting letter writer) which makes him sad, but hey
16:33
< TheWatcher>
(I also note I've read all of them)
17:15 * Vornicus pokes vaguely at it.
17:25
< gnolam>
Keep doing that and you'll go blind.
17:25
< Vornicus>
Truth.
17:26 * Vornicus is trying to fill in coordinates with distances from a line (well, squared, that way I get whole numbers) and his brain just isn't helping.
17:27
<@Tamber>
Simon: Hysterical raisins.
17:46
< gnolam>
?
17:47
< Vornicus>
??
17:48
<@Tamber>
?
17:48
< gnolam>
Hysterical raisins?
17:49
< Vornicus>
replace some of the vowels.
17:49
< gnolam>
... ah
17:53 Vornicus [vorn@ServerAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has quit [Connection reset by peer]
17:54
<@Tamber>
X is full of quite a lot of spiders.
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18:13
<@froztbyte>
Simon_Shine / Tarinaky: interestingly
18:14
<@froztbyte>
that "different programs use different pastebuffers" is only a problem on GNOME
18:14
<@froztbyte>
well, and anything still using Tcltk, but Tcltk is from The Old Days
18:16
<@froztbyte>
(which of course I don't even understand, it doesn't make sense whatsoever. but in any way I look at it, the gnome people seem intent on writing shit software so I've given up caring)
18:17
<@Tamber>
Not quite~ Shit software with delusions of Enterprise. *glares at all the XML*
18:17
<@froztbyte>
hehe
18:17
<@froztbyte>
I have no qualm with their design philosophy
18:18
<@froztbyte>
software that's easier to use is great for a lot of reasons
18:18
<@froztbyte>
but I have major qualms with their execution of it :P
18:18
<@Tamber>
Indeed. But there's that, and "Quick! A feature! Take it out before the users hurt themselves on it!"...
18:19 Syloqs-AFH [Syloq@NetworkAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has quit [Connection closed]
18:20
<@froztbyte>
Tamber: you don't even want me *starting* on that
18:20
<@froztbyte>
from another network...
18:20
<@Tamber>
Probably not, no; I'll never get to work on time if you do. :)
18:20
<@froztbyte>
<froztbyte> Spinach: froztbyte /gnome/
18:20
<@froztbyte>
<Spinach> froztbyte: froztbyte is the anti-gnome
18:20
<@Tamber>
hehe
18:20
<@froztbyte>
(someone else added that factoid)
18:20
<@Tarinaky>
froztbyte: rxvt uses a different buffer to everything else.
18:20
<@froztbyte>
Tarinaky: oh dear god
18:21
<@froztbyte>
Tarinaky: I'll supply you with a hill to hide out in :/
18:21
<@Tarinaky>
Huh?
18:21
<@froztbyte>
from the tactical nuke that's to be deployed and hit the world
18:22
<@Tarinaky>
I had to go out shoe shopping.
18:22
<@Tarinaky>
Can we go back and explain wtf?
18:22
<@Tamber>
Well, in the beginning...
18:23
<@froztbyte>
Tarinaky: A lot of software sucks.
18:23
<@froztbyte>
and you just happen to be using one such piece of software that sucks in some way.
18:23
<@Tamber>
All software sucks, all hardware sucks. :)
18:24
<@froztbyte>
although come to think of it I don't really know how you'd make rxvt work any better
18:24
<@Tarinaky>
"Every OS wastes your time from the Desktop to the lap..."
18:24
<@froztbyte>
perhaps make the pastebuffer disable-able?
18:24
<@Tarinaky>
I used to use gnome-do to copy selected text to the clipboard.
18:24
<@Tarinaky>
But I had to change my launcher because gnome-do wasn't launching anything.
18:25
<@froztbyte>
*snort*
18:25
<@Tamber>
In other words... gnome-do, gnome-doesn't?
18:25
<@Tarinaky>
Correct.
18:25
<@Tarinaky>
gnome-do didn't.
18:25
<@froztbyte>
it'll sound like I'm coming off as some snotty dick, but I don't think there's been a piece of software I've encountered in KDE-land that did that :/
18:26
<@froztbyte>
what I *do* sometimes have happening
18:26
<@Tarinaky>
Kupfer was worse than gnome-do.
18:26
<@froztbyte>
are things like firefox choosing that ctrl+c works in some places but not in others
18:26
<@Tarinaky>
Launchy is the first program I've found as a viable alternative to gnome-do.
18:26
<@froztbyte>
or some tcl app that doesn't even seem to know about copypasta
18:26
<@froztbyte>
(mibbrowser, for instance)
18:27
<@froztbyte>
I think the part about gnome that made me rage hardest was the inconsistency between gnome-terminal and, well, everything else :/
18:27
<@Tarinaky>
I've never used gnome.
18:27
<@froztbyte>
you don't want to.
18:27
<@Tamber>
My biggest issue is that I can't seem to change a lot of the keyboard shortcuts for things. :( e16 lets me do it! emacs... well, yes. But everything else? Damnit, I want to use C-w for deleting a word!
18:28
<@Tarinaky>
But the KDE based theme utilities look horrible.
18:28
<@Tarinaky>
The gnome themes look okay.
18:28 Syloqs_AFH [Syloq@NetworkAdministrator.Nightstar.Net] has joined #code
18:28
<@Tarinaky>
So I tend to prefer gtk based theming just because it looks nicer.
18:28
<@Tarinaky>
Which is a pretty weak reason I'm sure.
18:28
<@froztbyte>
I don't actually know how much effort is involved in theming things
18:29 Syloqs_AFH is now known as Syloqs-AFH
18:29
<@Tarinaky>
Oh. And I prefer the gnome MIME type thingy just because I have no idea how the KDE one works.
18:30
<@froztbyte>
hmm?
18:30
<@Tarinaky>
gnome-open iirc.
18:30
<@froztbyte>
oh
18:30
<@froztbyte>
is that like xdg-open?
18:30
<@froztbyte>
yeah
18:31
<@froztbyte>
xdg-open is the cross-DE version of that, works on the freedesktop standards
18:31
<@Tarinaky>
xdg-open is a shell script that looks to see if an environmental variable is set and runs gnome-open :p
18:31
<@froztbyte>
which is nice, because you can call 'xdg-open foo.jpg' which will launch the gnome app in gnome, or the kde app in kde
18:31
<@froztbyte>
and that's totally fine.
18:31
<@froztbyte>
:D
18:31
<@Tamber>
Funny, it works for me, and I don't have gnome-open. ;)
18:31
<@Tarinaky>
I've never gotten xdg-open to do anything other than go "I don't know what this is, try a web browser."
18:32
<@Tarinaky>
Tamber: kde-open?
18:32
<@Tarinaky>
Or whatever it's called.
18:32
<@Tamber>
Nope
18:32
<@Tarinaky>
Lucky you.
18:32
<@froztbyte>
vandali% dlocate -S kde-open
18:32
<@froztbyte>
kdebase-runtime: /usr/bin/kde-open
18:32
<@froztbyte>
Tarinaky: hmm
18:32
<@froztbyte>
Tarinaky: do you have the freedesktop stuff around?
18:33
<@froztbyte>
I recall when I was first poking at this, there was some xdg hack I had to pull off, but since then I'd built a new box with just my dotfiles installed and things seemed to Just Work(TM)
18:34
<@Tarinaky>
froztbyte: Depends what stuff that is.
18:34
<@froztbyte>
Tarinaky: then I'd have to check later, because I certainly can't recall right now :/
18:37
<@Tarinaky>
Ahah! Parcellite works.
18:38
<@froztbyte>
launcher?
18:39
<@Tarinaky>
No, clip board manager.
18:40
<@Tarinaky>
Ah! I think part of why I use gnome-open is because I use thunar, which itself is a gnome program.
18:42
<@froztbyte>
ah
18:47
<@Tarinaky>
Hmm... Damnit. Launchy isn't launching either :/
18:49
<@Tarinaky>
Oh ffs.
18:49
<@Tarinaky>
I'm getting a weird error.
18:50
<@Tamber>
What kind of weird error?
18:50 * Tamber goes to try turning the universe off and on again, to see if that helps.
18:50
<@Tarinaky>
My user doesn't have permissions on some files it owns.
18:53
<@Tarinaky>
http://pastebin.com/FFH614zw
18:53
<@Tarinaky>
I have no idea what's wrong or how to fix it.
18:54
<@Tamber>
...how odd.
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21:59
<@jerith>
Mercurial, you can tell that I have resolved a merge conflict by the fact that I have edited the file. Making me remember how to convince "hg resolve" to not *unresolve* my resolution is not friendly.
22:01
<@jerith>
Tarinaky: What are the permissions on the directory?
22:01
< McMartin>
heh
22:02
<@jerith>
"hg resolve" tries to resolve the conflict on its own, using the same voodoo that failed to resolve it before it told me there was a conflict.
22:53 Derakon [chriswei@Nightstar-f68d7eb4.ca.comcast.net] has joined #code
22:53 * Derakon sighs at work.
22:54
< Derakon>
Complete feature requested by boss, show feature to user, user's all "Dude, no, the old way was better." (And legitimately so)
22:54
< Derakon>
Bunch'a wasted work. :\
22:55 Vash [Vash@Nightstar-f03c5637.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds]
23:00 Reiver [orthianz@3CF3A5.E1CD01.C6689C.33956A] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds]
23:03 Vash [Vash@Nightstar-f03c5637.sd.cox.net] has joined #code
23:04 Serah [Z@Nightstar-827f56fc.cust.comxnet.dk] has joined #code
23:04 Vash [Vash@Nightstar-f03c5637.sd.cox.net] has quit [[NS] Quit: I <3Lovecraft<3 Vorn!]
23:04 Stalker [Z@Nightstar-827f56fc.cust.comxnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 121 seconds]
23:05
< McMartin>
Derakon: At least it's all billable hours, etc.
23:06 Reiver [orthianz@3CF3A5.E1CD01.C6689C.33956A] has joined #code
23:16 shade_of_cpux is now known as cpux
23:30 Reiver [orthianz@3CF3A5.E1CD01.C6689C.33956A] has quit [Connection reset by peer]
23:30 Reiver [orthianz@3CF3A5.E1CD01.C6689C.33956A] has joined #code
23:55 Vash [Vash@Nightstar-f03c5637.sd.cox.net] has joined #code
--- Log closed Thu Sep 15 00:00:52 2011
code logs -> 2011 -> Wed, 14 Sep 2011< code.20110913.log - code.20110915.log >

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