| --- Log opened Tue Feb 02 00:00:29 2010 |
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| 03:28 | | * McMartin grumbles at scons, which does not properly detect Python installs on 64-bit systems. |
| 03:29 | <@Kazriko> | Tons of problems with python installs on 64 bit windows... |
| 03:29 | <@Kazriko> | I installed 32 bit python this time to avoid that stuff... |
| 03:29 | <@McMartin> | I've been on it for over a year, this is seriously the first time I've run into it |
| 03:29 | <@McMartin> | And yeah, cue crossgrade. |
| 03:30 | <@Kazriko> | Pyodbc had problems and at least one other tool I was using. |
| 03:30 | <@McMartin> | ... oh, you dolts. |
| 03:30 | <@McMartin> | They also didn't set the manifest to run as administrator |
| 03:30 | <@Kazriko> | hmm. |
| 03:31 | <@McMartin> | There really isn't an excuse for this anymore. |
| 03:31 | <@McMartin> | Maybe when Vista was just out, but come on, folks |
| 03:31 | <@Kazriko> | nod... |
| 03:31 | <@Kazriko> | of course, at work we only have one test vista system... |
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| 03:38 | <@McMartin> | ... this is completely worthless |
| 03:39 | <@Kazriko> | This is why my Datamuxer script is running on a 32 bit copy of Windows server 2003 at work, when we have 2 perfectly good windows 2008 servers on 64bit. |
| 03:40 | <@Kazriko> | (perfectly good relative to other windows servers, that is. :) |
| 03:42 | < Alek> | of course. :) |
| 03:49 | <@McMartin> | Scons's installer jams a bunch of stuff into sitelib but does not include any way to actually, like, invoke it. |
| 03:49 | <@McMartin> | WTG |
| 03:49 | <@Kazriko> | i've had python apps like that... |
| 03:50 | <@McMartin> | And searching its packages for "__main__" returns no matches |
| 03:50 | <@McMartin> | Did the install fail? Even I do not know |
| 03:50 | <@Kazriko> | the modules documentation? |
| 03:50 | <@McMartin> | LOLZ |
| 03:50 | <@McMartin> | Like they'd document things like that |
| 03:51 | <@Kazriko> | a bare minimum of docs is pretty much automatic with module docs. *shrug* but probably not how to invokeit. |
| 03:51 | <@McMartin> | (By which I mean - no; top-level __init__.py was in fact the first place I checked. No obvious main programs in the core dir either) |
| 03:51 | <@McMartin> | Yeah, it says what names are defined in each file |
| 03:51 | <@Kazriko> | ah, no __init__.py means its not a real package either eh? |
| 03:51 | <@McMartin> | Oh, it has one |
| 03:52 | <@McMartin> | But it's just stuff like copyright info and date generated |
| 03:52 | <@Kazriko> | nod. well that's at least enough to get it there. ah well. |
| 03:52 | <@McMartin> | What I need is something like "dir" but which tells me which .py files do something interesting outside of all defined names |
| 03:52 | <@Kazriko> | yep... |
| 03:53 | <@McMartin> | I will ask our local scons expert tomorrow. |
| 03:53 | <@McMartin> | Time to go home and play Mass Effect insteda |
| 03:53 | <@Kazriko> | seems like it replicates functionality in other python tools... |
| 03:53 | <@McMartin> | scons? |
| 03:53 | <@McMartin> | Not so much |
| 03:53 | <@McMartin> | SCons is written in Python, but it's to replace Make. |
| 03:53 | <@Kazriko> | scons.org? |
| 03:53 | <@Kazriko> | ahh. |
| 03:53 | <@Kazriko> | so it's not a python packager, it's a maker for other languages.- |
| 03:54 | <@McMartin> | Applications written in Python are not allowed to lack obvious entry points. |
| 03:54 | <@McMartin> | Yeah, I'm trying to do a custom build of NSIS here. |
| 03:54 | <@Kazriko> | heh |
| 03:54 | <@Kazriko> | a section in its docs about building and installing without admin privileges. |
| 03:55 | <@McMartin> | Also a pile of lies~ |
| 03:55 | <@Kazriko> | it indicates there should be an executable named "scons" heh |
| 03:55 | <@McMartin> | Ahahahahahahahaha no. |
| 03:55 | <@Kazriko> | heh. |
| 03:55 | <@Kazriko> | have fun with mass effect. |
| 03:55 | <@McMartin> | There are no executables of any kind produced by the installer I downloaded from their site. |
| 03:55 | <@Kazriko> | I should do the same... |
| 03:55 | <@Kazriko> | (though, FF2 and FF12 instead here.) |
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| 06:58 | < gnolam> | LEVEL UP |
| 07:00 | | * gnolam wanders off to do web programming... in C. |
| 07:04 | <@Vornicus> | ... |
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| 08:45 | <@Vornicus> | Oh my god this code needs a refactor. |
| 08:47 | <@Vornicus> | http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/119 <--- I mean, it is crying. |
| 08:48 | <@Vornicus> | Though really it hasn't given me enough gain in that sense... |
| 08:50 | <@Vornicus> | http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/120 <--- this one is a bit cleaner but I'm still not a fan. |
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| 09:11 | <@Vornicus> | Ah, much better. |
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| 09:21 | <@Vornicus> | http://pastebin.starforge.co.uk/121 <--- now it's not actually completely insane. |
| 09:22 | < AbuDhabi> | Are you designing some sort of DnD-derivative character generator or something? |
| 09:23 | <@Vornicus> | not derivative. But yes. |
| 09:24 | < AbuDhabi> | What edition? That doesn't seem like standard pointbuy for 3.5e. |
| 09:24 | <@Vornicus> | 4e. |
| 09:24 | < AbuDhabi> | I seep. |
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| 09:25 | <@Vornicus> | (in 4e you get 32 points on the scale listed at the top, but at least five of your scores must be 10s.) |
| 09:28 | < AbuDhabi> | Not allowed to be inferior, eh? |
| 09:28 | <@Vornicus> | The minima and maxima are the actual possible minimum and maximum scores for each individual ability score; these were determined by experiment. |
| 09:29 | <@Vornicus> | The standard array (which, by the way, is now slightly /better/ than rolling 4d6 droplow) has nothing below a 10 in it. |
| 09:37 | <@Vornicus> | Anyway all this code does is generate the list of possible ability score loadouts. This has to now get converted to Javascript (I think I can almost do it line-by-line), and then I can include it in my generator. |
| 09:37 | | Vornicus is now known as Vornicus-Latens |
| 09:38 | <@Vornicus-Latens> | And now for my next trick: slep. |
| 09:39 | < AbuDhabi> | Wow! This wizard has a ring of teleportation and teleport control! |
| 09:39 | < AbuDhabi> | Awesome. |
| 09:39 | <@Vornicus-Latens> | Flee. |
| 09:39 | < AbuDhabi> | No, I am the wizard. |
| 09:39 | <@Vornicus-Latens> | Oh. Then flee things effectively. |
| 09:46 | < Serah> | Nightie? |
| 09:46 | < AbuDhabi> | Damn. I accidentally killed my kitten. |
| 09:47 | < AbuDhabi> | Now Anhur is angry. |
| 09:47 | < Serah> | ?? |
| 09:47 | <@McMartin> | You hear the studio audience applaud |
| 09:47 | <@McMartin> | Serah: AbuDhabi is playing a complex quasirandom game called "nethack". |
| 09:50 | < Serah> | Oh. |
| 09:50 | < Namegduf> | Nice. |
| 09:50 | < Serah> | Didn't know nethack had kittens. |
| 09:50 | < Namegduf> | Wait. |
| 09:50 | < Serah> | Yeah, I know. |
| 09:50 | < Namegduf> | You got a start that good, then angered your god and killed your kitten? |
| 09:50 | < Namegduf> | (Both of which suck) |
| 09:50 | < Serah> | Oh, I didn't. |
| 09:50 | < AbuDhabi> | Yes. |
| 09:50 | < Serah> | What's with the kitten? |
| 09:50 | < AbuDhabi> | It's dead, Jim. |
| 09:51 | < Serah> | But why was it essential at first? |
| 09:51 | < AbuDhabi> | An angry god is a bad thing. |
| 09:51 | < AbuDhabi> | The kitten is entirely dispensable, I've found. |
| 09:51 | < Serah> | I suppose, but does got like kittens? |
| 09:52 | < AbuDhabi> | Anhur is angry because I killed my pet. |
| 09:52 | < Serah> | So why'd you kill you kitty? |
| 09:53 | < AbuDhabi> | Because I underestimated the range of force bolt. |
| 09:53 | < Serah> | Oh. Your kitty was in the line of fire? That's a strange place to keep a kitty. Why'd you put your cat there? |
| 09:53 | < AbuDhabi> | I didn't put it there. It roams randomly. |
| 09:53 | < Serah> | And what is MCV going to think of you now? |
| 09:54 | < AbuDhabi> | I was cornered by a jackal and needed to kill it ASAP. |
| 09:54 | < Serah> | Punch it dead? It's just a jackal. |
| 09:54 | < Namegduf> | AbuDhabi: Only if you don't like cool shop loot. |
| 09:54 | < AbuDhabi> | Serah: And I'm just a level 1 wizard. |
| 09:55 | < Namegduf> | The kitten is also the recommended way of dealing with bad stuff at level 1 |
| 09:55 | < AbuDhabi> | The kitten was farther away than the jackal was. I was already injured. |
| 09:55 | < Serah> | BATTLECAT!?!? |
| 09:55 | < Namegduf> | Serah: Precisely. |
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| 09:55 | < Serah> | So AD is He-Man? |
| 09:57 | < AbuDhabi> | Yes. Didn't you know? |
| 09:57 | < Serah> | Nope, you got me fooled. |
| 09:58 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
| 09:59 | < Tarinaky> | Pfft. AbuDhabi isn't gay enough to be He-Man. |
| 10:00 | < AbuDhabi> | :] |
| 10:01 | | * Tarinaky wanders off for breakfast. |
| 10:04 | < AbuDhabi> | Somehow, I am wielding two daggers without #twoweaponing. |
| 10:05 | < Namegduf> | That's normal. |
| 10:05 | < Tarinaky> | AbuDhabi: We still on for the roguelike competition? |
| 10:05 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[d00m] |
| 10:05 | < AbuDhabi> | Tarinaky: EXAM SEASON, MON. |
| 10:06 | < Tarinaky> | Ahhh. |
| 10:06 | < Tarinaky> | Fair enough. |
| 10:06 | | * Tarinaky shall endevour to use this weekend to his advantage then. |
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| 10:24 | | * Tarinaky grumbles about his Electricity arrangements. |
| 11:54 | | You're now known as TheWatcher |
| 12:02 | <@TheWatcher> | electricity arrangements? |
| 12:22 | <@TheWatcher> | hm |
| 12:22 | <@TheWatcher> | is youtube being an arse for anyone else? |
| 12:24 | < Serah> | 0.216 second load time. on home page. |
| 12:24 | <@TheWatcher> | hm |
| 12:24 | < Serah> | Seems consistent on other pages too. |
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| 15:12 | < Tarinaky_> | Yay. I think I'm starting to get to grips with Windows Development. |
| 15:12 | < Tarinaky_> | (God help my soul.) |
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| 15:47 | < Tarinaky_> | So my windows form as an OnPaint method. I need to over-load its OnPaint method to do something different. |
| 15:48 | < Tarinaky_> | I tried declaring the new one as virtual but it complained that it wasn't 'sealed'. I have no fing clue what sealed means. |
| 15:52 | < Tarinaky_> | It's like a totally different language except it pretends to be C++ :/ |
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| 15:57 | < gnolam> | Declaring the overridden function as virtual in the child class has no effect. If the base method isn't already virtual, that won't change anything. If it is, the child method is implicitly virtual. |
| 15:57 | < Tarinaky_> | I know. I was hoping Windows had some magical thing that would let me >.> |
| 16:00 | < Tarinaky_> | I -think- "virtual void OnPaint(System::Windows::Forms::PaintEventArgs ^e) sealed new {}" works. |
| 16:04 | < Tarinaky_> | Having trouble getting GDI+ to work to test it though. |
| 16:05 | < Tarinaky_> | "'System::Drawing::Graphics::Graphics' : no appropriate default constructor available" |
| 16:14 | < Tarinaky_> | How do you pass by address? I'm guessing '^' is what VC++ uses instead of '*' >.> |
| 16:21 | < Tarinaky_> | Somehow the debugger manages to be more obscure and arcane than gdb. |
| 16:37 | < Tarinaky_> | Ahah! I got it to work. Need to figure out why it's not redrawing on resize though. |
| 16:41 | < Tarinaky_> | Well, specifically I think it is redrawing, but it's only drawing the 'new' bit when it needs to draw the whole window. |
| 16:41 | < Tarinaky_> | If that makes sense. |
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| 17:26 | < Tarinaky> | Lookit me! Imma Winbloze developer naow! |
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| 19:58 | < celticminstrel> | Huh, that's interesting. They were talking about Scons last night, and I was trying to use it today. |
| 19:58 | < celticminstrel> | It seems to think my computer is Windows. |
| 20:09 | | * gnolam shudders at the mention of it. |
| 21:01 | < Searh> | Scones? Yum. :p |
| 21:25 | < celticminstrel> | So, is there some way to fix that? |
| 21:29 | <@ToxicFrog> | scons --help say anything useful? |
| 21:30 | <@ToxicFrog> | Tarinaky: In VC++, * and & have their usual meanings. I'm not familiar with ^. |
| 21:30 | < Tarinaky> | It's VC++ 2008 Express. |
| 21:30 | < Tarinaky> | It -seems- to be using '^' instead of Pointer since I have to access members with '->'. |
| 21:32 | < celticminstrel> | Isn't ^ the Pascal indirection operator? |
| 21:32 | < celticminstrel> | And "scons --help" doesn't even print help. It just runs scons as normal. |
| 21:34 | <@ToxicFrog> | Tarinaky: search key "visual c++ carat" is useful here, and in particular http://blogs.msdn.com/branbray/archive/2003/11/17/51016.aspx |
| 21:34 | < Tarinaky> | I'll look in a second. Busy atm >.> |
| 21:34 | < celticminstrel> | ...um, this is the least helpful help ever: "usage: config [ -bcdo dir ] [ -p ] sysname" -- no indication of what the options mean or what the valid sysnames are. |
| 21:35 | <@ToxicFrog> | It looks like ^ is the handle type particle, which is like a pointer except it points to a garbage-collectable object. |
| 21:35 | < celticminstrel> | Ah, okay. Of course, that's not C++. |
| 21:36 | <@ToxicFrog> | Of course not. |
| 21:37 | <@ToxicFrog> | celticminstrel: no man page? |
| 21:37 | <@ToxicFrog> | Also, try, say, 'i686-linux' as the sysname (adjusted for your actual system) |
| 21:39 | < celticminstrel> | For scons? I think it's supposed to install one... the trouble is that you need to use scons to install scons, so the man page isn't being installed because something fails. If I remember correctly, at least. |
| 21:39 | <@ToxicFrog> | ;.; |
| 21:39 | <@ToxicFrog> | There's no package for it on your system? |
| 21:39 | < celticminstrel> | As for config, I tried "darwin" as the sysname, but it seems to expect the sysname to be a directory. |
| 21:40 | <@ToxicFrog> | Aah, it's OSX? |
| 21:41 | <@ToxicFrog> | (there's no README? No iNSTALL?) |
| 21:41 | | * Vornicus wins minor victories over some simple Javascript: populating a dropdown. |
| 21:41 | < celticminstrel> | Wait... it seems to be installed despite the error. |
| 21:42 | <@Vornicus> | Slightly wordier than I'd like. |
| 21:42 | < gnolam> | The last time I tried using Scons (and I really mean last; I have no intention of touching the damned thing again) it was completely broken for MinGW/MSYS, and I know people were having trouble with it under Linux as well. I doubt if it works on /any/ platform. :P |
| 21:43 | < celticminstrel> | I'm not using it because I want to... |
| 21:46 | <@ToxicFrog> | I've had no problem with it on linux, but I've used it exactly one. |
| 21:46 | <@ToxicFrog> | *once. |
| 21:47 | <@ToxicFrog> | And I intalled it from rpm. |
| 21:47 | < celticminstrel> | I could've installed from MacPorts, but I didn't want to download it... <_< |
| 21:48 | < celticminstrel> | ...what? Safari automatically copies everything off a disk image after downloading? :O |
| 21:50 | <@Vornicus> | CM: if it's a boring dmg with only one thing in it, I think it does. |
| 21:50 | < celticminstrel> | It had two things on it. Presumably it's a function of the "open safe files" preference, though, which I've just disabled. |
| 21:51 | < celticminstrel> | It couldn't handle tar.gz files, oddly - it would ungzip it and leave a .tar in the Downloads folder. |
| 21:51 | <@ToxicFrog> | My experiences with Safari's handling of archives have been uniformly terrible. |
| 21:58 | | * Vornicus now works on something in the other direction: using a change in a dropdown to do other things on the page. |
| 22:03 | <@ToxicFrog> | ...really, thinking back on it, I can't think of any part of my admittedly limited experiences with OSX that I actually enjoyed. :( |
| 22:05 | <@McMartin> | Now that I have it working, SCons is awesome. |
| 22:06 | <@McMartin> | MacPorts, however, is a steaming pile |
| 22:06 | <@McMartin> | I have yet to install anything from it that didn't try to pull in a complete reimplementation of X Windows that didn't compile. |
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| 22:07 | <@McMartin> | Note that the latest stable SCons release is *also* a steaming pile; our local expert's first step was to update to latest point release. |
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| 22:21 | | * Vornicus determines that 121 items is a /really/ long list. |
| 22:21 | < Tarinaky> | ToxicFrog: That explains why I never saw 'delete' in the example code. |
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| 23:04 | < Derakon[work]> | Hey, Rhamphoryncus: are you aware of any way that setting a value on a module-scoped variable (e.g. "seb.foo = bar") could cause a thread deadlock? |
| 23:05 | < Derakon[work]> | I mean, it's my understanding that generally-speaking, writing to variables could cause unpredictable behavior in thread situations, but shouldn't inherently cause deadlock. I'm just wondering if Python has some extra funny business going on that could change that assumption. |
| 23:22 | <@McMartin> | Python has a global interpreter lock; it's infamously bad at actually being parallel. |
| 23:22 | <@McMartin> | I'd be astonished if assigns weren't atomic |
| 23:22 | < Derakon[work]> | I know about the GIL. |
| 23:23 | < Derakon[work]> | Just trying to figure out how a function can hang between two log messages when the only thing it's doing is assigning values. |
| 23:23 | < Derakon[work]> | I guess the answer is that the GIL is hung somewhere else. |
| 23:23 | | * McMartin goes back to trying to get NSIS to do custom logging the way he wants. |
| 23:38 | < celticminstrel> | I think Scons is failing to locate dependencies, even though I have them. |
| 23:40 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[T-2] |
| 23:42 | | You're now known as TheWatcher[zZzZ] |
| 23:44 | <@McMartin> | celticminstrel: Are you using 1.2.0 or the latest point build? |
| 23:45 | <@McMartin> | (Also, if this is the issue *I* hit, are you on a 64-bit OS?) |
| 23:46 | < celticminstrel> | I seem to be using 1.2.0, and I'm pretty sure I'm running the 32-bit MacOSX. |
| 23:48 | < celticminstrel> | But (for example) it can't find OpenGL or SDL for some reason. |
| 23:49 | < celticminstrel> | Though search also fails to locate the latter, at least in the form of a .dylib. |
| 23:51 | <@McMartin> | I'd suggest grabbing the local build of "latest development" since that's what the docs describe, and also note that scons didn't by default import your calling environment, so PATH and INCLUDE and friends don't propagate through |
| 23:51 | <@McMartin> | latest development seems to improve scanning as that became unnecessary for us |
| 23:51 | < celticminstrel> | Okay... |
| 23:54 | < celticminstrel> | AttributeError. |
| 23:54 | <@McMartin> | That needs more specifics, I think |
| 23:54 | < celticminstrel> | One moment, I'm trying something else first. |
| 23:58 | < celticminstrel> | Okay. Building latest scons with scons 1.2.0 gives AttributeError : File instance has no attribute 'get_text_contents'. |
| 23:58 | < celticminstrel> | Building latest scons with itself (via bootstrap.py) gives the same error I got when building 1.2.0 with 1.2.0: "Make sure that Python modules _winreg, win32api or win32con are installed." |
| 23:58 | < celticminstrel> | ...which is a useless thing to say, since I'm not even on Windows. And then it terminates because the Windows package (which presumably it intended to create) was not found. |
| 23:59 | <@McMartin> | What's your HOST_OS? |
| 23:59 | < celticminstrel> | Um... |
| 23:59 | <@McMartin> | I mean, we use scons on Mac here in the office, and spent today making it work on *Windows*, which was the challenge |
| 23:59 | <@McMartin> | The Mac one Just Worked for us... |
| 23:59 | < celticminstrel> | A shell variable? |
| --- Log closed Wed Feb 03 00:00:30 2010 |